NROI Podcast
Want to know more about the USPSA and SCSA Rules? Need to keep up on the rules changes? The NROI Podcast is the place to get the rules, from the source. Join us for discussions on the rules, history of the sport, and other topics.May contain infrequent use of mild profanity.
NROI Podcast
108. NROI Podcast September 2026 #1
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Troy gives us a report from Setup for Factory Gun Nationals, we announce and discuss a new ruling regarding the definition of compensator, and more from the mailbag.
Note: Due to travel schedules etc. there will be no podcast on September 28th. We will resume normal schedule on October 12th.
Note: Transcriptions done by AI or other means may not be entirely accurate. This podcast, and any transcription thereof, does not constitute an official NROI ruling. Questions should be sent to rules@uspsa.org.
Disclaimers And Official Resources
SPEAKER_01This is the NROI podcast, your source for factual information for USPSA and SPSA competition. This podcast is brought to you by the National Range Oxfords Institute, United States Practical Shooting Association, and Steel Challenge Chooting Association. All roll books can be found at USPSA.org slash rules, SPSD.org slash rules, and on the USPSA and SPSD apps available in your Apple App Store and Google Play Store. All rates for this podcast are reserved. No portion of this podcast may be used or redistributed without written permission from the director of the National Red Octors Institute. Rule discussions on this podcast do not constitute an official ruling. Discussions on this podcast are meant to inform and educate. The only official rulings are published as per the bylaws of the United States Practical Shooting Association. Questions about rules should be emailed to rules at USPSA.org. This is episode 108, recorded early September 2026. Well,
Host Welcome And Travel Updates
SPEAKER_01hello everyone. Welcome to the NOI Podcast. I'm your host, Kevin Emmel, and with me tonight, as usual, are Troy McManus. Good evening, Troy.
SPEAKER_00Good evening.
SPEAKER_01And Jody Human. Good evening, Jody.
SPEAKER_04Good evening.
SPEAKER_01So, Troy, how about a report of Troy's travels? Let's see. I think the last time we talked to you, you were going to leave race gun and go home for an hour and 15 minutes and turn around and go back to Arkansas for the Arkansas sectional. And then kind of do the same turn and burn and head for St. George, Utah for setup for factory gun.
SPEAKER_00I think somehow approximating that. What had happened was uh yeah, I left race gun, went home, had a couple three days there, then I went to Sacramento for a seminar that I taught um out of YOLO. So that turned out well. 30, 28 people in there. Uh then I came home and I had a day and to turn around, and then I drove to Arkansas for the Arkansas section, uh shot and worked that match. And that was over Saturday afternoon, so I left Saturday afternoon. Uh listened to the LSU ball game on Sirius XM on my seven-hour drive home. Uh Sunday got everything prepped up and flew out here on Monday morning for factory guns. So uh got settled in yesterday and we started set up this morning. So it's going. I mean, it's a lot of trouble. And then I've got to leave here. I'm actually gonna have to leave this match early. I'm gonna leave at Sunday at noon and uh get the flight back home because Tuesday I'm flying to Greece for the shotgun water. So I think I slept in my bed three nights, maybe four, in the last I don't know, 45 days.
SPEAKER_01I'm I'm telling you, one of these times you're gonna walk in the door and your your roommate's gonna not who know who you are.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's true.
SPEAKER_01The dog will come up and bite you and shit. I mean it'd be bad.
SPEAKER_00Well, she'd be like, oh, that's that guy that cooks for me when he's here. Yeah, I was making a meal for us anyway, and a friend of hers was in town and she said, Oh, we I was thinking of going out. I said, Why don't you buy her to eat here? I got plenty. So they did, and and they stayed up sitting around talking and and having a few Adult beverages while I went to bed because I had a 6 30 flight out to Vegas. So I never heard anybody leave, but they were gone when I left.
SPEAKER_03So yeah.
SPEAKER_00I got a little bit of home time in, but you know, once this once world shoot's over, October and November aren't super busy. I I've got a couple of small things to do. Uh gator matches in November and there's something in October, I think. And then December is Jack Lancaster's mid-Mississippi Christmas classic, but you know, again, level two, not far away.
SPEAKER_03So it'll be fine. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Well, good deal. Jody, you any travels or fun things or other you other than you're getting ready to head for a factory gun like me?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, a factory gun, and then I have two RO seminars in October now.
SPEAKER_03So which one which other one did you pick up?
SPEAKER_04Uh Missoula and ETTS. Um Texas. And for some reason the tick plane tickets to Dallas were super expensive.
SPEAKER_01So football or hockey or something.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, something's going on in Dallas. The tickets are so expensive. But oh well. We gotta go teach classes.
SPEAKER_03Yep. That's for sure.
SPEAKER_04Because I I pass on a lot of classes because the tickets are just too expensive. And I just had when this class came in, I'd just been in Dallas for a work conference. And I was like, oh yeah, the tickets weren't that bad. So I didn't actually go and check before I said, sure, I could teach this class.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And then I got the class and I looked at the tickets and like, oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01Fun times.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah. I'm headed out to Factor Gun, driving down, headed out to Sunday. And uh then uh I got a class at the end of October, and it looks like I picked up another class mid-November. So um yeah, it's lots of wandering around. So all right.
New Compensator Ruling Explained
SPEAKER_01Um, so it hasn't all been travel for you, Therry. You've been uh you've been busy um putting out a new ruling and regarding compensators. Why don't you uh discuss that?
SPEAKER_00True. So we've had a lot of um for lack of a better word, uh, innovation and quotes in the firearm industry that started with uh well started with the the SIG model guns that had a compensator built into the slide. And I mean not dropping any names, Phil Stater. But uh that one he asked me about it right after they came out with it, and I told him absolutely not, it's a compensator. It's it's described as a compensator in the SIG literature. And we had a talk about it at the race gun, and he was telling somebody, yeah, I tried to slip that one by Toronto, but it didn't go right. So it's it diverts gases, it is not slide ports. Well, in fact, we had that discussion, uh, Phil and I did, because there was a a guy at the uh, I think it was the Area 7 Steel Challenge match that got bumped open because he was shooting one of those, and he tried to claim that it was a ported slide, which it is a ported slide, but it doesn't meet the definition of port slide ports like we think of them that might be used to utilize a ported barrel or just for lightning the slide, right? So this is at the end of the gun, it fits past the muzzle, it's designed to divert gases to reduce the recoil, so it's a compensation. Um lately somebody came out and and produced a YouTube video showing it, and it was titled something like uh I cheated in USPSA. But this thing was was attached to the light rail on a Glock hand gun. Um, and even I mean, people that should know better, people that are certified as range officers, uh allowed him to compete with that and didn't call it a compensator, even though how effective it is, it doesn't matter. It diverts gases to reduce recall. And but because it was mounted to the frame and not, you know, integral or or designed to be fitted onto the barrel or whatever. Or the slide. Yeah, or the slide. Well, then they said, well, they couldn't really call that, which I'm gonna put the just freaking stop button on that and you know call BS on it as well. Because look, there has to be a certain amount of common sense. And you know, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck, you know. So this compensator innovation just drove me to uh and especially the the ignoring it as a as a compensator and allowing it to be that to to write a ruling that basically says any device attached to the gun that's designed to divert gas is a compensator, no matter how it's attached. Uh it it specifically exempts the gas systems on AR rifles, on some handguns, on any other gun that's that uses gas in the recall system. That's not designed to reduce recall. That's how the gun operates, right? That's part of the operating system. But uh I think it's fairly broad enough where we won't see that frame mounted kind of thing. Um, this guy was shooting this gun in in L10, which doesn't allow compensators. The only division that allows compensators is open. Uh and he had a he had a dot mounted on it as well. But in L10, that's fine. You can have a frame-mounted dot or an optic, but you can't have a compensator. So he had a YouTube video showing it to the whole world, you know. And I mean, to me, that's just kind of rubbing our nose in it. Uh so uh ruling went out a week ago and the board voted on it, discussed it. I changed a couple of the terms in it, and then it went into effect uh on the 7th. So yeah, Monday. So I notified the board this morning that it had gone into effect and it's published on the USPSA webpage. And I understand Jody sent that information to Rick to update the online rules, etc. So that should all be in the works. Uh the thing that's gonna take the longest, obviously, is an Amazon book. Um I wouldn't hold my my breath waiting for them to update that book.
SPEAKER_04But I would just print the ruling and paste it over the current definition. That's basically the only thing that got updated, the definite definition of compensator in Appendix A3.
SPEAKER_00So But if you look up if you look if you use the online rules in any way, shape, or form, that should be updated pretty soon. But if you can't find it, uh you go to NL uh USTNC.org rulings and uh and the ruling will be there. This is the first ruling I've issued in a long time, but it was something that needed to happen. Yeah, absolutely. It doesn't change equipment divisions or anything like that, but I mean it was just getting out of hand, and and what was what was somebody else gonna come up with that that was just as outlandish as that, right? So uh you gotta have some control over over divisions, and this is one of them. Now, should the membership put enough pressure on a board of directors to allow compensators in other divisions or create a new division for I don't know, strike or fired uh short barrel guns with a comp and a dot, then that's up to them. We did that once years ago. It was called modified. It wasn't striker fired, but it was you know modified short barrel guns with a comp and a dot. And it didn't last very long because if you're gonna do that and spend that kind of money on that gun, you just buy an open thing.
SPEAKER_01Well, an Ipsy had it as well, and they were freaking punishing you shoot.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, because it was you know, your comp was all essentially poppa holes along the barrel, and all that blast is coming right back in your face.
SPEAKER_04It was they were they were horrible. That sounds horrible. I mean, the open guns with the pop-a holes are horrible.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I shot doing it with a shorter barrel.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I forget who it was. I somebody at a nationals had one, and over in the function fire bay, they let me shoot it, and that was real quickly illustrated to me that I did not want one.
SPEAKER_00So I said somebody handing you a 500 Smith and Weston Magnum and saying, Here, pull it.
SPEAKER_01Pretty much. It'll be fun.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it'll be cool.
SPEAKER_01No, it won't. It'll hurt. I I've shot one of those too once.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00That's like uh that movie Harley Davidson and the Marlboro Man. He's like, What did you learn to shoot with? This 454 Casul. Nobody learns this though. I did.
SPEAKER_01They had one hell of a flinch.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Anyway. Yeah, no. Yeah, just no.
SPEAKER_01Anyhow, all right. So yeah, that's out there if y'all want to go read it and look it up. Um and there you go.
SPEAKER_04Uh also, and and that definition was updated in all three rule sets.
SPEAKER_03Correct. Yeah, it's the six things.
SPEAKER_04So you all know.
SPEAKER_00And it covers suppressors. So suppressors are specifically called out, but any device that you know diverts gases to for any effect, essentially, is uh uh deemed to compensate. So we're working on allowing suppressors and rifles and multigun rules, and that's gonna be fine. If they're allowed, they're allowed. There's no the definition doesn't hurt that, right? Right. Yeah. So but you still can't shoot a suppressed handgun in uh in USPSA competition.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
Podcast Schedule And Sticker Plans
SPEAKER_01Um we do have a couple of podcast announcements due to travel schedules and everything else. Um we will we're not gonna have an episode in two weeks. Um and by the time Troy gets back from Greece and the rest of us manage to light and be home for a bit, um, it'll be time for the next episode. So we're just gonna give this the the one that would be two weeks from when this episode comes out, which is the coming Monday. Um, we're just gonna give that one a pass. Um so anyway, don't don't panic, don't email me, don't email Trier Jody, don't call the head office, nothing. Um you've been told. The other thing is um just um on a on a lark, I had a bunch of uh just freaking stop it stickers uh printed up. Um I may or may not have had a beer or two and been playing with chat GPT and um ended up designing a sticker. Um very limited production, very limited. Um so Troy will have some, Joey will have some, I will have some at Factory Gun Nationals in St. George. If you are staff and you listen to the podcast, come chat with us and we might give you a sticker until we run out, and then we won't. Um so I'm going to hold a few in reserve um that we may give out in the future um for people that send in really excellent questions, especially if we get to use the question and turn it into a question of the month, um, you know, just as added incentive, but we're gonna we'll keep a couple in reserve. But anyway, that's that's so that's happening. Um a couple of people were pushing me to create hats, and that started headed into the world of Etsy store or you know, getting USPSA or inner, you know, to sell them. And we're no, we're not going there. Um, so anyway, that is that is coming. See you at Factory Gun. Now, you can only accost us on the range. Don't bug us in the restaurant, don't bug us in the hotel, don't bug us in anywhere else, only out on the range and don't interrupt whatever we're doing. If we're actively taking care of customers, just stand around and wait. Limit it one per um, etc. I don't care if your best friend Ralph couldn't come and he really, really wants one, too bad. Um we have to we have to say the best friend Ralph is out of look. Yeah, your best friend Ralph could have come. He should have spent a thousand dollars or more to come to Factory Gun National to see a sticker that he didn't know was going to be a level. So anyway, there you go. Um, don't email me, don't email the the head office, don't call the head office, do not pester Terry. No, I mean the head office doesn't even know I did this. And by the way, before anybody gets their nethers in a knot, I paid for these out of my own pocket. So there was no member money spent. Well, I'm a member, but um there was no member money spent on this. This was just this is just something fun to do. And we've kind of been looking for ways to actually engage uh podcast listeners face to face. We've all run into you know some listeners out in classes. Um it seems like the listenership is higher in the CRO classes than in the RO classes, which kind of makes sense.
SPEAKER_04Um so but uh I know I've had a couple of well hopefully hopefully they become listeners after.
SPEAKER_01Well, and I've had a couple of students email me. I had one guy like three weeks after he passed his test, he emailed me and said, I've made it through all the episodes. And I'm like, wow, damn, bro. Okay, you apparently have nothing else to do. Yeah, because we're at, I mean, it's this is the 108th episode, and most of our episodes are at least an hour long. Um, we have a couple that are up in the hour and hour and 40 minute range. We have a few that are slightly under an hour. Um, like the first one I think was 38 minutes, but um so it's like wow, that's a lot of listening. Um, turns out he had like an hour and something commute every day. So he was killing off one or two episodes a day. So anyway, um, yeah, good job. Um, anyhow, um, so that's that's the uh the announcements um for the podcast. All right. Anything else we need to talk about before we dive into the mailbag?
SPEAKER_00Nope.
SPEAKER_03Let's go.
SPEAKER_00Well, if we start selling stickers on Etsy or something, I mean rest assured we will use the the proceeds for something good, like Scotch. Age bourbon, Scotch.
SPEAKER_04These podcasts don't make themselves.
SPEAKER_01I mean Aberler, a 16-year-old, is not cheap, folks. I mean especially in frickin' Washington. Anyway. Um yeah. Oh I made a mistake. I didn't pour any of that before we started recording. Oh well. Anyhow. Yeah, right. It's like, damn it. Okay.
Steel Challenge False Start Call
SPEAKER_01Into the mailbag we go. Um and some of these, as as always, you know, I got a question from somebody who you didn't read my whole question. Well, yeah, because it was like 16 paragraphs. Um, these get edited. All right. Uh first one, we are in need of your wisdom and expertise to uh ref refer reference a recent event we experienced which led to differing differing interpretations. Could you review the following and advise on the correct rules and outcome required using steel challenge rules? So in this case, we're talking about rim fire pistol, and it really applies across the board. Um, shooter starts before the timer signal goes off and hits the first steel plate, but is stopped until he is disqualified by the RO. Should this have been treated as a false start or should the shooter have been disqualified? Troy, I think that was yours.
SPEAKER_00I did. Um, this is basically a false start. It doesn't really fit the definition of false start and steel challenge, but we're we need to change that so that it mirrors the USPSA thing.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_00Um, but he didn't do anything unsafe, even though there's a rule in the Steel Challenge book that says any shot outside of a time string.
SPEAKER_04But he was able to without RO permission.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, without RO permission. So RO permission, RO supervision, whatever. That rule was put in there so that you could not just simply fire out a still ground without the RO saying go ahead, right?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, but this is just a false start. I would not have disqualified that person for that. You just stop them. You got to go reset your stage, paint the plates, etc. But that's just a stop and a restart once you get everything painted. Um same thing in USPSA sort of thing. But there is a little bit of a of a divergence in the way those roles read and still challenge in USPSA competition roles, which they really should be treated the same. Uh a lot of people consider a false start if you move it ahead of time, but if you move it at the at the timer, That's creeping, right? If you move it ahead of time, the RO just needs to stop you and put you right back in this in the same place. And that's just movement before the start signal. Or essentially not being in the correct start position. Um, but false start actually when you draw and fire or or raise and fire in this case, then that's a stop and a reset.
SPEAKER_03Yep. All right.
Bullets Through Walls And Scoring
SPEAKER_03Moving on.
SPEAKER_01Uh in a recent match, the shooter's bullets, plural, two shots, made obvious impact with the corner of a wall before hitting the target. The bullet holes in the target were oblong, and the assumption is that they were upset by the wall and hit the target sideways. There were two discussions. The first revolved around whether the wall hits were full diameter versus partial diameter hits. Due to the condition of the wall, which had been taped and retaped multiple due to multiple hits in the past, but was not taped for this match, but it was a level one, it was not all that obvious to me whether they were full or partial hits. The second discussion involved the fact that the bullet strike exceeded a bullet's diameter. There was no visible evidence, such as a grease ring indicating a bullet strike, but it was obvious that the holes came from the shooter's bullets. What is correct? Forget him. Well, wasn't me.
SPEAKER_04I didn't answer that, but I mean, if you're gonna have walls, they're gonna get hit. Put some spray paint on them or something, so you at least can tell if they're new hits or not.
SPEAKER_03I mean, restore it with tape, yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um but what do the rules say about hits exactly? I mean, if the if the holes were that misshapen and there was no grease ring or anything, they probably were full diameter hits.
SPEAKER_00And you couldn't find a radius to tell you that a piece of a bullet would do it. Yeah.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00I don't know. I mean, I don't know how disordered it had to be passing through a wooden wall with paint.
SPEAKER_04Well, if it's gorilla tapic, sometimes slope hangs on to the bullets. Yeah. I mean, without a picture, it's very hard for us to give a definite answer.
SPEAKER_03Yep.
SPEAKER_04Right. But you know, to me, in my experience, if the hole is that misshapen and there's no diameter, no grease ring, usually it's gone through a full diameter through a wall or a barrel or something. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Barrels, especially.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Probably should have been misses, but there was a lot of failures here, right? So the wall wasn't properly restored. So that just makes your RO's jobs harder. Right. And then ultimately that affects the score of a competitor. And I know local matches, we don't paint the steel, we don't patch the walls, but it really doesn't take that much to do those two things to avoid because you spend how much time arguing and debating things later.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_01Well, and the reality here is if you couldn't come up with a what the real what the real call is, then it's reshoot time.
SPEAKER_02Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01And you know, now you're wasting even more time. So uh that's yeah. Just just freaking stop it, people. Restore your walls, paint your steel. Um I mean, I yeah. I won't get up on that particular podium. Yeah. Could happen. Uh let's see.
PCC Cartridges Plus Subsonic Warnings
SPEAKER_01Next question. Could 300 blackout ever be considered for a PCC cartridge? A 220-gram projectile at subsonic speeds would be comparable to 45 ACP. On one hand, there's a recoil advantage over 9mm AR-style rifles with the heavy direct blowback bolt carriers, but recoil is still significant more than roller delayed platform uh like MP5s, etc. Well, the first, before we even get buried into the platforms involved, a 300 blockout is 30 caliber. The minimum cartridge for a for PCC is nine millimeter, which is going to be 356, 357, 358, depending on what bullets you're loading. 30 millimeter or 30 30 cal doesn't make it. Um 30 cal is 0.300. Um again, depending on what bullet you're playing with. But um, so yeah, the answer is no. Um, it's also considered a rifle cartridge. Um, I'm not aware of anyone making a handgun for it. Um, well, I'm I'm sure somebody has. Um and perhaps whatever the Thompson, you know, the Thompson contender line of handguns, they probably have made a barrel for it because they make a barrel for everything else. Um, you know, I'm they made a barrel for 4570 for a while. So um anyway, it is that is considered a rifle round.
SPEAKER_04And um this is not there there is guns, pistols.
SPEAKER_01There are, I figured as much. Yeah, but it's still considered, I mean it's still considered a rifle round, you know.
SPEAKER_04It's oh yeah, yeah. Well, it's a single shot, so you might want to shoot a it's a single shot. Um, it's called a brawler, it's a single shot handgun, but um you want to use that in a match.
SPEAKER_00So but all right, let's say let's take a 230 grain 45 ACT running at 890, 875 feet per second, something like that.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Versus a 220 grain projectile, subsonic speed is roughly a little less than 1125 feet per second.
SPEAKER_01It's typically quoted as 1050, depending on altitude, etc.
SPEAKER_00That's a pretty pretty powerful power factor. Yeah, it's gonna be 200 minor, right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Well, I guess how many feet per second? It's not so much about fire uh power factor. Well, it has to be that, but we also have the maximum feet per second for right.
SPEAKER_00Well, it would be less than that. Yeah, because it's subsonic. So anything less than that, it could be a thousand feet per second, and you'd have a 220 power factor, which is crazy. I mean, I I don't know, but it is a rifle cartridge. This is why 30 carbine isn't allowed, because it's a rifle cartridge and it's 30 caliber, right?
SPEAKER_01And 30 carbine tears the hell out of steel.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, 30 carbine is is hot.
SPEAKER_04So and and that's why we have these restrictions for PCCs, is because of steel and trap from the steel and all that stuff.
SPEAKER_00So I mean, you're I have I own a 40 caliber PCC and a 45 caliber PCC that I shoot on occasion, and they're fun to shoot, but you're you're competing with essentially what shooting major power factor in a minor power factor game, and it's just not comparable, right?
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Uh the 45 likes to make nice big holes. I mean, that's good, but it's not 300 blockout, no rifle caliber, like you said.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And by the way, while we're talking about subsonic, um I've uh Russell Fortney was was we were talking about uh calibration ammo and whatnot, and he had found run across the Megilla uh 9mm and said that it would make good calibration ammo, but he had um people trying to use it at a match, a level two match with a chronograph, and they had gone subminor. And this is just a reminder to folks if the box is labeled subsonic or the velocity that's printed, do the math, isn't going to make minor. You you're shooting for no score. Um, and I have sitting here on my on my desk a box of Reminkin subsonic 9mm that was given to me, and it's 147 grain bullet, and the muzzle velocity printed on the box is 945 uh feet per second. I haven't run it across the chronograph yet, but um that is that is definitely not it's not gonna make it. Um so just just buyer beware. Don't run out to the gun store to buy ammo for a big match. And especially if you're buying enough for like factory gun, because you're gonna want it probably 600 rounds. It's about 430 for the match, I think. So you're gonna want about 600. Um, you may have just bought a whole lot of subsonic ammo. Now, the good part of that is you can justify that new suppressor you wanted for your nine millimeter handgun with the wife, because well, I've got all this ammo. Um, but then if she competes, she's like, no, you just got calibration ammo for you just got calibration ammo. Now you're the RM for the rest of your life.
SPEAKER_00So it's your box is 147 green and 945 feet per second? Yeah. That's 138 power factor.
SPEAKER_01Oh, it's 138. Okay, those do make it. They oh that's right. The Agila that Russell was talking about was 124s.
SPEAKER_00So you gotta make about a thousand fifty feet per second with a one twenty-four to just barely make one twenty-five power factor.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but they were they also had 950, I think, printed on the box.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so yeah, be yeah, be careful.
SPEAKER_00It is subsonic. It is I mean so is a big fat 45 ACP in most cases.
SPEAKER_01I wouldn't want to shoot one if it was hypersonic.
SPEAKER_00Supersonic? No.
SPEAKER_03That would be painful.
SPEAKER_00That's when you break out that heavy-duty big gas revolver, shoot it out of that.
SPEAKER_01There you go. Yeah, because you're gonna waste a whole bunch of gas out of that cylinder to barrel gap. Um, that'd still be punishing. Anyway, just be careful when you're buying your ammo. Um, the best thing, of course, to do is when you buy, if you're even if you're gonna shoot factor ammo, either buy certified, get involved in the certified ammo program and buy your ammo for your match. Your big match is that way. Or if you're gonna buy it at your local distributor, um, you know, look at the lot number on the box and try and buy your entire match, same lot number, and then get out, go either get a chronograph or go find somebody that has one and run it under cr over the chronograph and make sure that you're getting what you paid for. Um, because it's there've been more than one person who showed up with factory ammo and not made it. Um and it's not if it's not in the certified ammo program, there's no insurance.
SPEAKER_04So and also remember if you do the certified ammo, you just buy in the ammo is not all you have to do. You also have to fill out the form and give delivery samples at check-in. Because if you don't fill out the form and give the delivery samples, when you go to Chrono, you're just like any other competitor.
unknownYep.
SPEAKER_00You're not in the program.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, Russell knows that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. So he knew it and didn't turn his form in. And then Chrona went poorly. Oh that was last year. We're still giving no crap.
SPEAKER_03Well, yeah, we aren't gonna let him off that easy.
SPEAKER_04No.
SPEAKER_01Okay, moving on.
Rule References In Stage Briefings
SPEAKER_01Um, I really enjoy the blog posts and the podcast. Thank you for the work you put into them. I only wish they were more there was more content. You're all doing a great job. Yeah. Um, we're making more all the time. Um, there's you'd be surprised that this the three of us sit around sometimes going, you got an article idea? No, I don't. Do you?
SPEAKER_04What are we talking about for this episode?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Um, thankfully, y'all send us questions, and that a lot of our blog content and certainly a lot of the podcast comes out of the mailbag. So um I want to anyway, continuing, I wanted to float an idea based on situation discussed in the blog. I've been involved in sport for about two years and have been only been an RO for a few months. So far, I haven't encountered a stage that use the particular rules discussed in that article. I think that was a 1155, maybe.
SPEAKER_04Uh no, I think it was the strong hand we can and gaining support with your incapacitated hand.
SPEAKER_01Okay. My thought is when the stage involves an unusual or less commonly encountered rule, why not include a brief reference to that rule in the stage briefing at a rich stage plan? I understand that it would be impractical to include every applicable rule, but when a stage intentionally relies on a unique situation, calling it out ahead of time would help prevent confusion and avoid creating a gotcha situation for competitors. It seems like the situation described in the blog could have been avoided with a little additional clarification in the stage plan. Back in the days when I got into the sport, WSBs were replete with rule numbers and you know, handgun made ready, parade, bot, dot, whatever, competitor per, you know, all these different rules. Um, and some people got really crazy with it. Here's the deal people standing there listening to the written stage briefing don't necessarily have a rule book in front of them. Certainly didn't in the days when I started in the sport. Um, nowadays everybody's got it on their phone, so they technically do. But if everybody starts looking up rule numbers, they're no longer listening to the rest of the written stage briefing, they're looking up a rule number. So if if you want to include a reference to, you know, whatever rule, briefly mention what it's about, um, that's great. That's that's there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. Um, but if you, you know, I I tell students um when we're talking about writing written stage briefings, the instant you start quoting uh rule numbers at people, they stop listening to their WSB. And they're they've either tuned out because they don't want to listen to numbers, or they're diving into the rule book to look and see what that rule is.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, I mean yeah, it assumes that they know that they understand what that rule is, right?
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And if they don't, then it doesn't mean anything. It's just verbiage in the stage brief. And if they do bother to look it up, hopefully they don't do it right then. But I mean, it's what if you quoted the wrong rule, right?
SPEAKER_01Because that's never happened.
SPEAKER_04Uh well, I mean, so I we do occasionally see that at local matches, right? Because the one thing local matches don't have is dedicated stage staff, right? Whereas, like for nationals, let's say as an example, when I'm RM, if there is a stage like this, that situation, or a stage where they're gonna have to be counting shots or a fixed time stage or whatever, I usually visit with the RO crews and say, okay, you're up on all your strong hand weakhand rules. What if this happens? What if that happens and kind of quiz them and make sure they know the rules so they can apply them? Also, I want to make sure they have the right information. So when a competitor asks, hey, if I shoot, you know, I'm shooting weak hand around this wall, can I put my strong hand on this wall? I don't want the RO being like, yeah, you can do that, and then applying penalties later. I want the RO to be like, well, you can do that, but you're gonna earn some penalties, right? Um so but a lot of times at local matches, sometimes they do write things in like, you know, oh, this is a 1155 stage. It'll be a per shot penalty if you shortcut kind of thing. Yeah. Um, so it's just you gotta, you know, part of it was we hope our ROs are trained enough, but also, you know, if you do come across something that's a little strange and you don't know if it violated the rules or not, that's also what the RM's there. I know that's another thing local matches don't do is have get into the heads or call the RM for stuff, right?
SPEAKER_01Well, if they've even declared an RM.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, if they've even declared an RM.
SPEAKER_01But which you should do.
SPEAKER_04Yes.
SPEAKER_01Yes. Yeah. And it really and yes, the rules say the match director can also be the range master at a level one. It's kind of a conflict of interest for one person to hold both jobs. Um, so it's it's better to have two people uh filling those two roles. Plus, it takes it's it's kind of nasty to put that all that load on one person. So because if you read farther in the rules, you'll find out that rangemasters can file arbitrations against things and they don't have to pay for it. And now you have Rangemaster arbitrating potentially a stage that was put on the ground by the match director, so he's arbitrating himself.
SPEAKER_00And yeah, that's just that probably wouldn't happen. Yeah, it's just messy. So uh you go look in the mirror and go, I'm gonna arbitrate that stage you did. Well, you're a moron.
SPEAKER_01Yep.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, it's just just no. Um anyway. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Moving on. Is
Stage Walkthrough Etiquette And Control
SPEAKER_01there an actual rule that prevents a person from rehearsing the stage while the RO is reading the written stage briefing to the squad? I know that 324 mandates that a squad should be allowed to walk through after the WSB has been read, but that rule does not directly prohibit squad members from walking the stage during the WSB reading since an RO is present. 873. There is no rule prohibiting this. If there is no rule prohibiting this, can the RO claim it is unsportsmanlike conduct? It does not seem to meet the definition of that per 10.6.1. And so I originally answered this and came back that the guy was actually he was the one wanting to walk the stage because he didn't feel he got enough time in the walkthroughs. And that, you know, we used to always get five minutes, and now um people are cutting it down to four minutes and even three minutes. And I know World Shoot has done on some, you know, Standing Shoot stages has done like a minute or minute 30. Um, you know, and he wants more time in his walkthrough. And you know, it's there's it's a courtesy thing because it's very difficult to be air gunning a stage, listening to the CRO read the written stage briefing if they're even facing your direction. They we typically are facing uprange, so our voices probably aren't going to carry downrange to where you're at. And then you're gonna come back with a whole crap ton of questions. How many rounds is this? Is this Virginia Count or Comstock? And you know, the whole what's the start position, all stuff that was covered in the written stage briefing. Um just making one.
SPEAKER_04There are people who are who are facing you and listening to ask those questions.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And so, you know, it's and it's a courtesy thing. Yeah, um, it's it's very much like you know, teacher standing in front of the class and everybody's on their damn phone and or they're talking or whatever. It's the same, it's the same thing. And it's it's a courtesy thing. Is it is it unsportsmanlike? Not until we tell you to stop doing it and you keep doing it, and then you're not obeying the reasonable uh order of an RO. Now it is unsportsmanlike. Um, would we ever hand that out? Depends. If we tell you to stop doing it and you tell us what we can do with ourselves, um describe some anatomically impossible situation. Yeah, that's yeah, that's 10-6, folks. Um you know, that's people have been DQ'd for things like that in the past.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you're right. It's it's an etiquette thing. And see the blog post that that Jody uh wrote. By the way, they posted your blog post on every stage at the Arkansas section match. And I think that I think they should start doing that everywhere. Okay, because that stuff's kind of getting out of hand. I saw a video somebody sent me of about I don't even remember what it was, but it's a it's a little short-ish course, right? There's not much shooting area. But the guy the RO tells the competitor to make ready, and he draws his gun and and looks like he's gonna take a side picture, which is okay, right? Um, and then he just runs the course from side to side, you know, air gunning all the targets, which is not okay, right? That's why that rule that says you can't move from a start location without honoring permission is in there to prevent exactly that. Now, to the extent that he went, it wasn't that far a distance, but he did get, you know, a gun in his hand pointing at the targets where he could look at his site, etc., which is typically not something we allow in the standard walk through. The other part of this, and it's kind of a fed people mind, is you as an RO need to be in control of that stage, right? Yeah, so if that guy's trying to walk away, you go, uh uh, come back here. You had your walkthrough period. As soon as I read this, you're gonna have. Uh an official walkthrough period because everybody knows that they walk the stage before you read in most cases, right? Yep. Um but you still have to read the official stage brief and you still have to control your stage. So that guy, if if I was a CRO and he was trying to walk the stage while I was reading, I would simply stop and call him back and then not let that happen, right? Um in a recent match where I was a CRO that were people, once we got reset, I was the last person back up race to make sure everything was taped and reset and the range was clear. And there would be people trying to run the stage, you know. And I'd be like, Nope, your walkthrough period's over. Get back up there and be ready to make ready. Right. And some were like, Well, I get to walk through, yes. While we're resetting, you get to walk through while you're in the on-jack shooter. Right now, we're going up range and you're gonna make ready and you're gonna shoot the stage. And a couple of grumbled about it, but the rest of the squad were like, Yeah, that's the right thing to do, you know. So you don't get to do everything you want to do just because there's not a rule that prevents it. That RO is out there for safety first, but he's also in charge of that stage.
SPEAKER_02Yep. Yep, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Stuff like that just makes you a little salty. I mean, it comes under the just freaking stop it thing, too, you know?
SPEAKER_01Yep, pretty much. Okay. Um, let's see. Ah, there we go.
Unintended Discharge And The Stop Call
SPEAKER_01Uh, at a recent local match at a relatively new USPSA club, the competitor fired two legitimate shots at a target and then started to turn and had an AD while still pointing in the general direction of the target. They had not moved by definition. The trot wasn't over the berm, wasn't within 10 feet into the ground, and there was another target in sight just to the right of the original target. The competitor paused, knew he had to, knew he had a surprise discharge, looked at me, I looked at him, he finished, and then he and the squad questioned why I didn't stop him and why it wasn't a DQ. I brought up the rules and asked if any fit. Per recent podcast, not all the ADs result in a DQ. However, 104 reads as it reads indicates uh any AD should result in a stop. If an RO knows the AD doesn't want it in the DQ, should the competitor still be stopped and then given a recoil. Gets into what is the definition of an X and L discharge or an unintended discharge? Um we also call this the Foley rule sometimes because he was famous for that.
SPEAKER_00How do you know I wasn't even at that target? Exactly.
SPEAKER_01Because you were looking at me. Because you jumped.
SPEAKER_00Right. So I think I answered this one, but you you should always say stop. And if you look like if you think that that shot was not intentional, and it sounds like from the description with the competitor asking why he wasn't stopped, he knew it wasn't intentional. I mean, we had a couple cases of that at Race Gun. Well, you know, uh I could shoot through a wall, yeah, but you can't shoot through a wall while you're running on the side of it. I mean, you could accidentally shoot through a wall while you're shooting at a target, you know. So I mean, just from his description, you can't tell if this would have actually fit anything that that might result in a disqualification. And and don't get me wrong, we're not looking to disqualify anybody. If it doesn't qualify, it doesn't qualify. But um definitely you should stop that person and then sort out what happened, what you saw, what your other ROs saw, and you know, work from there. You shouldn't just let him continue because did you did you automatically know that it didn't go over the perm? I mean, did you automatically know that it was within range of that target that he may or may not have been legitimately able to engage? So you gotta work all that stuff out. But yeah, it this would always warrant a stop call and then a a discussion about what actually went on. And so if it turns out that it it was unsafe and then it's a disqualification, if not, then you simply get a reshoot. But if if you you always want to err on the side of caution and you know stop people for that. Uh if he stopped and looked at you, yeah, yeah. I don't think he intended to fire that shot. Now we don't have an unintentional discharge rule, but still um one of the people that arguing his disqualification for it at Nashals, I said, Well, did you intend to fire that shot? He goes, No. I was like, he shot through my banner, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_00But yeah, that should be a stop. I mean, regardless if it doesn't fit any of the conditions that that are defined as an accidental discharge. And error on the side of caution and stop the guy and then work it out, right?
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_01So you know, if if he actually hits a target.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's now you're just you know, you know, like if they have like they're getting into position and they haven't shot that's like six inches to the side of a target. And it's a little early, I'm not gonna stop him. But this sounds like he was moving, yeah, right, or starting to move. Yeah, that's different.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, that's anyway.
SPEAKER_01Those are those are easier to Monday morning quarterback and harder to do in real time. And we we all get that. Um that's one of the fun parts about the podcast is we get the Monday morning quarterback the heck out of things.
SPEAKER_04Sometimes with not all the details.
SPEAKER_01Well, usually without all the details, which makes it more fun. We can make stuff up. Yeah, the guy was wearing a blue shirt. What does that matter? It doesn't matter. Anyway.
SPEAKER_00I heard a question today about 1155 and based on a text description, but with an accompanying video that showed another competitor not violating 1155. And I was like, this video is useless. Yeah. I don't know what where his the other guy you're talking about speed went, right? I don't know. That's the ultimate. Oh, you didn't get all of the story. No, I didn't. I looked like this guy shot it right. Looked okay.
SPEAKER_01So this guy did it this way, and I didn't do it that way. Yeah, basically.
SPEAKER_04I need to chum the Facebook waters with the newest question of the month.
SPEAKER_03There you go.
SPEAKER_04I'll do that later this week.
LPVO Scopes In Steel Challenge
SPEAKER_01Um, let's see. I was in a steel challenge competition recently, and a debate came up regarding LPVO, and I actually had to Google this because I didn't know what that acronym was. It's low power variable optic. My day we call them CQB scopes. Anyway. Uh anyway, low power variable optic scopes. Someone there was shooting for the first time and had one. There was a debate as if of if they're allowed to be shot in room fire rifle optics division or not. Someone said that it gives an unfair advantage because of the magnification capability. Can someone please provide me with clarification on the issue? And I think Troy, you answered this.
SPEAKER_00I did. There, there's in any division, whether it's um USPSA competition rules, if you're allowed an optic, there's no restriction on the magnification of that optic. Um, in the rifle, shotgun, and multi-gun rules, there there may be something that's for some of the divisions for red electricity. Under some of the divisions. So you could have a you could have a non-magnified red dot with a flip-up magnifier, right? Yeah. But that's pretty, pretty significant. I mean, pretty specific to rifles. So, but in steel challenge, you can have a magnified scope, a telescope on your on your Rifle, you can have it on your PCC, you can do it in USPSA. Um personally, I failed to see the advantage of a magnified optic in steel challenge. Yeah. Yeah. You're not trying to shoot a group, you're just trying to hit that plate, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I think a big wide non-magnified optic with a I mean, if you look at the circle dot kind of configuration of some of the holocons have, you pretty much if that plate's in that circle, you can pull the trigger, right?
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yep.
SPEAKER_00Uh magnification on that, I don't think, would help you. But there's nothing in the rules that prevents it. I mean, if that's your your thing, go for it. I don't think they're they're that far away.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Maybe not our limits.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, but there's the big plates that are far away.
SPEAKER_01You'll see those. Well, we could reverse. We should make uh a character a uh different stage and use like the small plate, you know, 10 inch plates way out there.
SPEAKER_03That'll that'll slow them down. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And a big old square stop plate. Anyway. Um, yeah. Okay. Well, that's all that I managed to glean out of our uh email in mailbox. Um we got anything else, or did you answer a question that I didn't manage to get on the
NROI Jerseys, Rockers, And Roles
SPEAKER_01list?
SPEAKER_04I do. So I got a question about, you know, we've talked about the NRI jerseys before, you know, how we like you to wear them when you're working matches, not just you're not a shooter competitor in the match. Yada yada yada. Um someone asked me, so you know, at major matches. At nationals, whatever. Um, a lot of times you're working a position that is not your certification. For instance, a lot of the range masters are CROs at nationals or ROs at nationals, right? And someone asked me, well, if I get my inner eye jersey and I'm and he, this person was an RM, they're like, but if I'm working a stage, I was told I can't wear the RM rocker on my jersey. But then someone says that you wear the RM rocker when you work stages. Yeah, because I'm a range master, that's my certification level. But it doesn't mean that I'm doing the range master job at the match.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_04I can have the rangemaster rocker on my jersey, but if someone comes and asks me a range master question, I'm gonna be like, yes, I'll call the range master for you. I'm gonna stay in my lane. I'm not gonna do things that are outside the task that I'm assigned. Um, you know, we allow the ROs to get those rockers on their jerseys to help signify. We have the colors for how many years you've been on RO, but then the rockers are to help ever, you know, let everyone know what your certification level is. And I mean, I usually when I'm working a stage, I try not to wear my instructor jersey. I have other colors, jerseys for that because I like to blend in. But um, or if I want to take pictures on the stages, I don't wear the red jersey because everyone's heads swivel. Oh my god, she's here to watch us. Um quick, follow the rules. Yeah, yeah, follow the rules or else. Um but yeah, you can wear, you can have the whatever rocker you are your certification level on your your inner jersey and not be working rangemaster. That's fine.
SPEAKER_00It's a it's a badge of a team, but it's not necessarily your position at that match.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And that's why at Axel's we give everybody a name type that actually lists what they're doing, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00But you're right, we'd have a ton of range masters that work as CROs or even ROs, and some of the instructors too. So uh just because you have that special specific ticket in your pocket doesn't mean that that's where you're gonna work at a at a match, right? Because we've all worked as range officers and chief range officers and stats officers and everything else, even though we got RRM tickets a long time ago, you know.
SPEAKER_04It's fun. I I I actually enjoy working in an RO or CRO.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because it's it's so fun when people walk. I wear my instructor jersey sometimes working as an RO because people come up and ask me questions and I just go, I'm happy to call the rangemaster for you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I'm an RO at this match.
SPEAKER_04And well, I mean, if it's not match related, I'll answer people's questions.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, you everybody needs to keep their hand in it on all levels, I think, right? Oh, yeah. So work as an RO with somebody. And and if you're if you're an instructor or you're a very experienced RM and they're doing something wrong, try to mentor them, right? Fix that problem. That's part of your that's part of why you have that badge on your jersey. But it doesn't mean you're in charge of everything.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Uh just you know, do your job, but there's nothing wrong with being a mentor or a coach.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, especially if they're using the wrong range commands.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_03Fix it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Or you're you're working, you're an RM and you're mentoring a new CRO who doesn't understand the the subtle art of making sure your stage has enough supplies. Or that, you know, when it's target change time is the CRO, you read the WSB and send your ROs to go start the target change. And then when you're done with the reading the WSB, you come up and help with the target changes. You know, little things that save you time and keep your stage moving.
SPEAKER_00Or here's a good one. If you're a race master and you have a right side diagonal target hardcover, but you're holding one upside down, it will look like the left side is the hardcover. That's just a tip. Just a pro tip. Yeah. Not speaking.
SPEAKER_04Was it an Ipsit target or a USPSA?
SPEAKER_00Ipsic target.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, those you want to make sure those are right sided up. I've been there, done that.
SPEAKER_01Don't send your ROs out to change those.
SPEAKER_04When they need reading glasses.
SPEAKER_01And assume that they know that which way is up, literally.
SPEAKER_00No, they they both call and say, This tar my targets aren't right. What are you talking about?
SPEAKER_01Is that like the the carpenter threw kept throwing away picking up nails? No, picking up another nail, he'd pound that one in, he'd pick up another nail, no, pick up another one, no, pick up another one, pound that one in. So what the hell are you doing? He says, Well, those others for the other side of the house.
SPEAKER_00Heads on the wrong. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Uh my.
Club Culture And Reset Expectations
SPEAKER_00But you know, it's all in a day's work for that kind of thing. So uh really though, you guys go to the blog and get that etiquette, folks, because that's an excellent reminder to people how they're gonna how they should behave when they're walking stages, etc. Right. I think we've strayed from that because it's just not the same um generation of shooters as when we originally started the sport, right? And things changed, I understand that. Um different generations do things different, but there's manners and there's being rude, and that is universal, right? Yeah, that shouldn't have anything to do with whether you were born in 1957 or whether you were born in 1997 or whether you were born in 2000, right?
SPEAKER_04Um also if you know a lot of this is what happens at your local match. You know, we have a lot of no news shooters showing up at local matches, and make sure they're paired with someone who can teach them the etiquette of, yeah, we help reset, unless you're the on-deck shooter or you've just shot, right? Um, you know, teach them about staying out of the shooting area. Um, you know, club culture. A lot of this stuff goes back to club culture, which we talk about a lot. And you know, we can't change it. It has to be the clubs have to want to change it. We can give you guys advice and stuff, but you know, the culture of someone reads the WSB out loud and actually time's the walkthroughs, so some squads don't have 10-minute walkthroughs at a local match. Um, you know, the ROs, policing, you know, making sure people aren't poaching the shooting area. Um, you know, making sure people are helping reset and understand that is expected at our matches. That's you know, this is not a shoot and we have servants or paid people to reset the stage. This is a group activity, right? You can socialize while you reset a stage. Um of that is just etiquette that's not in the rule book. Yeah. I remember uh the 2018 Area One, I was sitting there, we had all the instructors there mentoring CROs. And I was kind of sitting there because I saw George arguing with this competitor, and I was kind of waiting for him to call the RM. He didn't. But the guy was like, Well, if it's not in the rule book, you can't force me to do it, and walked off. And so to the next stage. And so I kind of go, hey, what was that about? He goes, Well, this guy was poaching the shooting area for on every shooter. He was in there walking the stage between, you know, when he should have been out resetting. And you know, George was explaining to him that he couldn't do that, that, that. And this guy's attitude was, well, if it's not in the rule book, I can do it. I'm like, we shouldn't have to be publishing this kind of stuff in the rule book.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_04Because it's already long enough.
SPEAKER_00You still have to ex have to have a certain amount of common sense for certain things, right? You we can't possibly rule everything. You know, I mean, there's no written rules for life, basically, and people seem to get along and understand common manners and courtesy and you know, right and wrong, that kind of thing. I mean, you just can't you just can't write a book that tells everybody what to do. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know, just but you know, courtesy in society in general has really slipped. You know, it's when I was growing up, you held the door for a lady. And if you didn't, you got your ears boxed. And you you learned real quick, you hold the door. You know, you just do that's what you do. And I was following a couple students walking into a building the other day, and the young man who's obviously had an interest in the young lady that he was with, he reached out and he held the door open and she looked at him and said, What the hell are you doing? And he says, Well, I'm holding the door for you. And she goes, Wow, nobody's ever done that before.
SPEAKER_00Wow. And like you were gonna say she called him a children's pig or something.
SPEAKER_01No, no, I mean, she was kind of like, he goes, Well, no, it's called chivalry. It's, you know, look it up. And I'm like, I'm impressed. And I even said to the young man, I said, I'm impressed. Good job. And the young lady's like, What? Is this something guys do? Yes, it's something we do. Well, we used to. I mean, it's but the that whole thing, it's it's it seems to be dying. And that's not a good thing for society, in my opinion. But you know, what do I know?
SPEAKER_04Well, you know, we want matches to be enjoyable for everyone.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And if the squad's squabbling about if there's that one person who's always poaching the shooting area and the squad gets resentful towards that person, it doesn't help people have while everyone have a good match. So if we all, you know, are polite to each other and kind of follow our etiquette, everyone has a good time. It's kind of like the same person who the one person who never resets, right? Yeah. I mean, now if they have a really legit reason while they're resetting, usually the squad's cool with that. But if it's just because they're just not doing it, they're not being a team member, um, yeah, then the squad gets resentful and they start being mad. And you know, that's not good either.
SPEAKER_01Pretty quickly, the RM is explaining to the squad the way you handle that is when he comes up ready to shoot, make sure the stage isn't reset. Let it make him go out and reset his own stage. And yeah, it's gonna burn a bunch of time, but he'll he'll get the message. I've yet to see that have where a shooter has had that happen and had it happen twice at the same match.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you're gonna burn some spawn, but it's still worth it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, there was there was one where the guy that was doing it was the last shooter. I was a CRO on the stage, and he was last shooter, and this this the squad had told me what they were doing. And I'm like, okay, cool. And he came up to shoot, and they all left. And he's like, Hey, that target's not taped. I said, No, none of them are taped, and the steel isn't stood up. Get busy.
SPEAKER_02He's like, What?
SPEAKER_01Those assholes. I said, No, you're the asshole. You didn't go out, you have not been resetting. I've been watching you, and your squad's been complaining about you. So this is An object lesson, go reset your stage, then you can shoot. He was not happy. But he was gonna, you know, write USPSA and get me thrown out and all sorts of things. And it's like I think he figured it out. He's as far as I know, he never wrote because I'd probably be one of the people getting the letter, but oh well. Anyway.
Factory Gun Setup And Barrel Painting
SPEAKER_01Anyhow, anything else?
SPEAKER_00I got nothing.
SPEAKER_03You got nothing?
SPEAKER_00Except you have a early day tomorrow.
SPEAKER_01You have a need to get horizontal and be asleep. Yeah. And uh hopefully drink a bunch of water so you can be hydrated tomorrow for at least half an hour.
SPEAKER_00We're in a yeah, we're we made a good start on setup today, so I I mean we'll be fine. Um, I got a good crew, Danny Mentor painted all of the barrels, so we painted them all in himself rather than painting them and himself. And um evidently the Home Depot folks don't know how to make black paint. They know how to make a nice dark battleship gray. So our barrels are battleship gray, not black, black, but it'll work.
SPEAKER_01It'll work.
SPEAKER_00The contrast is what you're looking for, right? So they're all blue or white barrels, so they'll show up when they're struck. Um I understand that we're supposed to be getting another 11 or 12 in tomorrow, so he's still got paint left, so we'll probably paint those. But yeah, he was pretty painted up today.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's good for him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03All right.
SPEAKER_00I didn't I he he earns the points painting barrels though, because that's usually a job nobody wants to do with paint. Yeah. But I'll tell you the truth, assembling your barrels in one spot, right? In other words, making a bunch of double stacks, because that's what you need most of the time, and putting them all in one place and not having all that paint and the sprayer and the generators running around, uh, was massively more efficient than doing it the normal one. Right. So they all look good. There's no skips, there's no, oh, a wall was here, I couldn't get to that edge, or there's no crap on the wall. So it worked out really nice. And there's a big stack of these battleship gray barrel uh barrels out there. So thanks to Danny Metzer for doing that.
SPEAKER_04So are we gonna have to buy a battleship gray spray paint?
SPEAKER_00No, we'll just use black. Okay. It'll make a black spot, but it'll be okay. Yeah, I don't think they sell a gray that color in a spray paint. Here too. Primer primer gray. Primer this is a little darker than primer gray. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Heretoforth, that color will be known as Danny Minter Gray.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh there was something about the guy said in order to be able to tint it black, which which I bought paint at Home Depot before and said I need five gallons of black. And they made it and it was black, right? Did you buy the cheap base? I don't know. This guy said he had to pour he had to pour some out in order to put enough tint in it to make it black. And he couldn't do that.
SPEAKER_01Oh he didn't start with he didn't start with the deep base. There's your problem right there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01He started with a bright white base instead of a deep instead of a deep base, which is already gray.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's you know what? That might have been maybe Danny picked that base. I don't know. Could be. I'll have to ask him tomorrow. If he did, that's gonna be funny.
SPEAKER_01From my former career in college of being a under-the-table semi-professional painter, I learned that lesson by asking questions when I went to Sherlock and Williams, and the guy said, Well, you know, you need the deep base, so what the hell's that? He explained it to me.
SPEAKER_04Oh, well, okay, now I understand.
SPEAKER_00It's already gone.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. Yeah, any of your deeper, darker colors are gonna almost always use the dark base.
SPEAKER_03But okay. Anything else? That's it.
SPEAKER_01All right, hearing nothing. Uh
Contact Info And Seminar Promo
SPEAKER_01as always, folks, remember you can contact us, uh, send us your questions, your comments, whatever rules at uspsa.org. And we will all three be at Factor Gun um next week. So the answering of questions might be a little slow, uh, at least until the main match. And um I'm one of the RMs, Troy's doing RM type things, um, Jodie's and stats. So um if things slow down, we might start looking at questions and answering those while on the fly, but it may be a little slow for a little bit. So just be forewarned. And again, if you're there at the match, come say hi. And we might have a sticker for you. With that, thanks everybody, and we'll talk to you later. Good night.
SPEAKER_02Good night.
SPEAKER_01Are you looking to take your first range officer class? Maybe you're looking to upgrade to chief range officer or audit a seminar to brush up on your rules knowledge. The complete list of upcoming classes can be found by following the link to find NROI seminars under the NROI tab at USPSA.org. No class is near you. Your club can sponsor an NRY seminar. Follow the request seminar link under the NRY tab at USPSA.org.