Introduction

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Questions about roles can be emailed to roles at USBS.org. This is episode 98, recorded late April 2026. Well, hello, everybody. Kevin Emmal here with the NRY podcast. And as usual, tonight, our tournament remote. Good evening, everybody.

SPEAKER_01 1:11

Good evening, everyone.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

And Jody Human.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

Good evening.

SPEAKER_00 1:15

And joining us again is our director of media and events, Jake Martins. Good evening, Jake.

SPEAKER_02 1:20

Hi guys, how are you?

Slot Codes Explained Simply

SPEAKER_00 1:22

Good. So, Jake, you had something you wanted to get on the podcast and go over. So take it away.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

All right, well, Tora and I were talking about it uh last week and leading up to it. And part of this is kind of covering the registration process for nationals, what took place with race gun nationals leading up to uh pre-registration, open registration, and then factory gun nationals registration that is going on right now. So uh slots are administered out for the match based on the slot policy that's out there that are performance and uh performance earned slots and activity slots. So the the difference between the two are performance earned slots are based on your performance at nationals in your division class or category, your your performance in your division class and category, if you shoot your area match that you're a resident of that area. Um so if you finish top 10 in your division, you're gonna invite back for pre-registration from nationals. If you win your class or category, um you get an invite back as pre-registration, and that carries down if, for example, if I was good enough to win production at the Area 5 championship, I would have got a pre-registration. There were 430 slots that were issued for performance and section activity. Uh section activity is based on uh uh the clubs submitting uh match results, and then the slots are awarded to the sections, and the section coordinators are supposed to distribute them by performance or by volunteerism for the for their bylaws. So that's that's what we go too far. How many slots total were there available? So the match itself, if you don't if you don't count the pre-match, right, and I'll explain that. Um so it's it's 36 squads of 13, which we max, um, which is 468 slots in the main match. So we issued 430 of the 468 for pre-registration because we do hold back some for uh sponsors, and we do both we do hold back some for the staff that is ROing the paid competitor slots in the pre-match. Right. Um the pre-match adds 72 total slots. We don't count that in the uh performance and activity earn slots um because we added that as kind of a bonus that's out there. And that's the same for race gun and factory gun.

SPEAKER_01 4:16

So in the um in that number though, in that 430 number, how many were basically just performance slots? Because I think that's what a lot of people miss, right?

Race Gun Sellout And Waitlist

Factory Gun Dates And Deadlines

SPEAKER_02 4:27

Um I would have to pull that up and look at it, but it's not hidden. You literally can go to the USPSA website, you can go and click through and actually pull up by each match who earned a slot on performance and how many slots were issued to your section. Um and it lives on the website, it's as transparent as you possibly could get. Um, what is not on there is how your section coordinator distributed the slots that were sent to them. Right. Um, so if you have a question about that, you should contact your area director and ask them what bylaws were followed by the section coordinator and how they administer the slots that were sent to the section based on activity. Um so leading up to Race Gun Nationals open registration, an open registration and strictly based on slots that were not used. Uh if all the slots that were administered, like I said, we would have 430. Um so that would just leave the pre-match and then whatever sponsor slots we didn't have used up. Uh on Saturday, this past Saturday evening, April um 18th is when it opened at 7 p.m. Eastern time, there was only 27 main match slots available and uh 33 43 pre-match slots and that was all that was available, 70 slots. So with communication practice score leading up to it, letting them know that it was gonna get hit hard, there was a 404 gateway error that people experienced. Um I saw it on my end for a minute and 47 seconds. I screen recorded it. Um the first entries started coming in at 701. Um and by 708, the match had sold out, and we shut registration off on Sunday with 283 people on the wait list. Um cleaned up as much as we possibly could. One of the things that it doesn't matter the size of company that's out there, one of the things that software companies struggle with. If you've ever been shopping for something that and you put it in your shopping cart and you go to checkout, and all of a sudden when you get hit pay and it comes up and says this item is no longer available, like that's the same thing that happens with the slots and the squatting. Um there are hundreds of people that are pinging it at the same time that are putting a squad in their cart and going to pay. Um, so we cleaned up as much of that as we could, and I started working through the wait list on Monday. If you were on the wait list for RaceGo Nationals, you receive an email from me that shows exactly where you were at based on your registration on essentially from Saturday evening to Sunday evening before we shut registration off. At a certain point, it's just ridiculous to keep allowing people to sign up and sit on the waitlist. So turned it off and then started kind of cleaning up some of the duplicate entries, which there was about 38 duplicate entries. Um that is just where it crashed on people and they went back in and it popped back up. And then we got as many people squatted that were in limbo, where they did get approved and paid, but when they went to go and squad, there wasn't a squad there. Um, so that's all cleaned up, and then I started working on the wait list. Uh officially started working on the wait list the people that were on there today um offering pre-match slots because that was all that is available. Uh seven emails or yeah, seven emails were sent out to the first seven people on the wait list asking if they wanted to accept a slot and to hop into the pre-match, um, which, if they're in the pre-match and the slot opens up in the main match, they are allowed to move because it is self-squatting up until a certain point. Um, so that's kind of where we're sitting with that that match right now. Um squatting is locked. Uh that way people can't go and move themselves off of a squad, and then somebody moves into that because they were trying to do something. So I lock squatting and probably for the next week or two until we start getting some withdrawals. Um, but that's how we're working through it in order. And what that basically means is that somebody requests to withdraw from the match, I withdraw them, I approve the next person on the wait list. They have instructions that they have 24 hours to accept their slot by payment. Um, and then I'll move them into that available slot. Uh, and that's how we're gonna work it right now. All right, cool. Yeah, the registration for factory gun nationals, same thing's going on. It is pre-registration, which means slot code. Um so it's the same 430 slots, slot codes were sent out to performance earners based on those divisions, which is carry optics, single stack, production, and revolver. And then um the staff codes went out, the uh sponsor codes went out. We do still hold some slots back for the sponsors that haven't signed up yet, um, because we are still soliciting some of that since that matches in September. And we'll do the same thing on May 16th is the date. So if you have a pre-registration slot code, it will expire on the 15th. And open registration is at 7 p.m. Eastern daylight time, May 16th on practice score. Um we have been in communication with them. Uh so hopefully we don't experience the same kind of thing, but um not gonna bash on them at all. Uh, we get what we pay for. Practice score has and always will be free, according to the higher ups at practice score. Um so it kind of is what it is until there's either an alternative solution or some updates to that. But again, I mean, it when you've got that many people pinging and hitting refresh for that limited number of slots, um things things don't always go the way that we want. It's the easiest way to say it. Um, so if you're trying to get into Factory Gun Nationals and you don't have a slot, step one, contact your section coordinator. Step two, contact your area director asking them how your section coordinator distributed the slots. Step three is be fast on the keyboard. Uh send a dry firing on a target. You may want to just practice, refresh, and enter.

SPEAKER_01 12:16

Yeah. Like Sheldon Cooper and crew on Big Bang kind of getting a comic con. Refresh, refresh, refresh. Right.

PracticeScore Load Problems And Fixes

SPEAKER_02 12:23

Right. Um, Rick Rotzel, our uh director of IT and I were like looking at alternatives of you know software for large events, and there was one that we were talking about that does marathons for 5,000 people where you select your slot in the marathon and um and looking at what they charge on some of that. Um it's it's very very interesting. On are we in a position to have conversations with other software places that are about nine to twelve dollars a head for using their software is what it figures out to be. So um, you know, there's a lot of conversations that should be had, um, and and hopefully they get had forwards there. Yeah. But that's where we're at. That's what I wanted to cover just because I know that you guys uh your guys reach with your podcast. You've got a lot of ROs, a lot of mass directors uh that that are on the ground doing the stuff in the sections and at their clubs, so they're able to answer these questions. Um, we did the same thing with Brian uh on the 180 Go Behind the Lens on his Rumble channel where we went over the same stuff. Um go watch that. Uh but if you have any questions, feel free to reach out to me. Um but again if you're on the wait list, you got an email tells you exactly where you're at. So if you are 281, I wouldn't necessarily book travel yet because 280 people need to withdraw and not have 280 people accept a slot before you before it comes up. Not saying it won't happen. I just wouldn't do a non-refundable trip right now.

SPEAKER_00 14:18

So unless you really want to go there anyway.

SPEAKER_02 14:22

Just yeah.

unknown 14:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:24

Yeah. You want to hang out and pace for your buddy, have that.

SPEAKER_01 14:27

What's that what's that stand made at the odds be forever in your favor?

SPEAKER_02 14:31

Yeah. But anyway, I mean that's all that. I just wanted to cover that because I know there's a lot of uh I went and shot a local club match on on Sunday. Um and you know, just kind of walking up there. There was several questions that were asked. Um, so I wanted to get out in front and and have some conversations about it. And then like I said, feel free to reach out. Jake at uspsa.org is my email. Um, I will I will get to those just like I get to the people on the wait list as they come in.

Performance Slots Versus Activity Slots

SPEAKER_01 15:05

Yeah. I was I was glad to hear you wanted to come and talk about this because I mean there's of course if you look at social media, there's all kinds of people making comments about this, that, and the other, you know, uh how it should be done, et cetera, that have probably never tried to run a match of that size or register for a match of that size in a in a rush like that, right? Especially a match that has slots. But I mean, if you go check on the on the web page and look at the number of performance slots, of course, you get a lot of comments like, well, this should only be a match for masters and GMs. And I I completely disagree with that. Absolutely. I think the guy that won B class at his area match is just as proud to go shoot B class and maybe win that in NASA as any GM out there, right? Everybody has that right to go compete.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

Yeah, I I agree because I mean the classification system is what is the hook with USBSA, and we are awarding your performance based on uh the vision and your class and your category as well. Um, so there are people you should this should this flot system be more towards performance? Um, I believe there are some areas that could be tweaked. And with that, is it top 10? Is it top 15? Is it top 25? Um do we go a little deeper at the area match? I think there's some things that you can look at and do. Now, when this was written, um it was based on the size of the matches that were out there. So, you know, yeah, if we say let's go to top 25 in each division on eight area matches and uh the nine divisions of USPSA, well, go do the math. Right. If everybody accepted that slot, that's more than the 468-person nationals. Oh, yeah. Um, and the way that the way that it works to get people through, you either have more days and you're running um more of a match. So people are shooting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and then the second group of people come in and shoot Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Um, so you're essentially running back-to-back nationals on the same type of stages, which we've done similar things before. Um do you award the performance that's out there based on the sizes that we have now, um, which are two nationals that are gonna hold all set and done. If you include, if you don't, if you don't include staff, which I think you should, um, the matches are going to be about 650 each. So that's you know, 1,300. And that even when we were running four nationals, that's about what we were getting. So we're we're maximizing what we have, keeping costs down, um using the ranges that are coming to us. So the other thing is to have a larger match, you need more bays. Um so we're at 18 uh is how this the bay structure works and what we're using between the ranges that we're at right now. Um, to go up, you need 22 or 24 to kind of balance out the flow of the match. Um, and that does that eliminate that doesn't even take into account uh Side in Bay and a demo bay for sponsors. So the reality is you need 25 to 30 bays, and now you're also looking at uh a staff match or a pre-match, that's a week. Then the match itself is a week. Yep. Um, and I don't know if anybody's checked hotel room rates and travel rates, but you're asking a lot. So yeah, we you could expand it to a thousand-person match. But are a thousand people gonna go at seven nights at two hundred dollars a night in hotel? So you can make it this big, but you may not get the turnout.

SPEAKER_00 19:30

I think the a lot of people don't even have that much annual leave from their work.

SPEAKER_02 19:34

Right. That's that's the other thing, too, is is like, can I get can I get a week off? Plus can I get two weeks off? Can I get staff? Yeah, that can get you know 15 days off. Um and we damn near killed people at nine days of nationals, and then the next year we expanded it to a back-to-back format that was 11 days, right? Give giving a one day off in the middle of it. So, I mean, we've tried all these different formulas and formats, and um obviously the format that we have is desirable because it's selling out. It has sold out, continues to sell out, it has since 2023. Um, I think there's some tweaking to the slot system that needs to be done to go a little bit deeper in performance, and I think that at the section level, it should be awarded based on your performance at your section match. So if you're an active competitor and you shoot your section match or your area match in nationals, your chance of getting a performance-earned slot, and there's there's three opportunities versus the woe is me, I can't get into nationals. Um I I think that's where some fix can be at, um, crunching numbers and deciding what that looks like. Um so and again, you know, that and I don't want to sound like I'm passing the buck on this, but the board actually writes that policy. That policy was written in 2018, approved by the board. Um, it's not been changed. Um, and I have brought this up a few times over the last couple of years of we need to look at it. But I I am relying on the board, and there's been some conversations that have taken place even Monday of this week with some board members about okay we yeah, we see it. We we we're gonna we're gonna fix some things. But on the flip side of that, there's sections out there that don't have bylaws. Yeah. Right. Yeah, and that's been pointed out many times. So there's some I mean there's some holes in the process that need to be plugged um before we start saying uh woe is me, I can't get into nationals.

SPEAKER_05 21:57

Not to mention, I taught an RO class there. even know what a sectional was because their sections never had one. They didn't know who their sectional coordinator was. So right. I mean I know our section used to not have really have bylaws. And the perfor the slots that they did get were handed out to sometimes just to the people who put the most into running the club matches. But they have since you know got bylaws and now that it's performance based and they have better better rules for how they're handing out the slots between all the clubs.

Why Nationals Cannot Just Expand

SPEAKER_02 22:36

So with the update of the bylaws that the board just voted in, um there's a policy that's online that talks about uh that this the slots for nationals should be performance based but it also has a line in there that at the section level it can be based on volunteerism. Yeah. And I will tell you that when I was a section coordinator in Indiana if I would offer it to the person who won their division in class at the section match and then if somebody said no I don't want it and again just because you won B class you know B production at the Indiana section match you may not have wanted to go to Frost food Florida. And then that slot became available to where yeah I did offer it to some club folks but that was within the bylaws. I personally think this is coming as as a competitor as a former section coordinator match director and whatever my title is with this now I think it should be 100% performance based. I think the bylaws for the sections and for nationals in general if it's a 500 person match 500 performance earn slots um and the sections do receive those based on the activities that are generated in there. So they're encouraged to to turn stuff in and do it on membership stuff but it goes to the section winners first. And then anything left over is then open registration because that that's a that's a fair way of like hey I just joined USPSA um I want to go and experience you know everything that's going on and uh I see the open registration. Now the reality of it is if we continue down this path of selling the matches out and the format that we're doing, it's still going to be tough to get in. You know the demand is there. Does it automatically mean we start splitting them up and start holding more nationals? I don't I don't necessarily think so. Troy and I were on a conference call this week and I kind of voiced my concern that as soon as you open that box and then if it's contracted to somebody for two years and then they don't want to do it, you got to go find something else. Is it always sucks to give people something and then have to take it away.

SPEAKER_05 25:07

Yeah. And the only other thing I'd say about so like area won area slots, right? We can always we always I'm assuming you know it's the area the the winners the top performers from that area. Like you know so the one I know this has been a discussion in our section because our clubs don't have you know it's just the range you shoot at but what defined makes you a member of our section right so I think they wrote in you have to shoot so many matches or something like that. Because you know our section match draws way people from outside the section like crazy outside the state. That's critical.

SPEAKER_02 25:59

Yeah it it is and I can tell you like when I ran the Indiana match some classic nationals was right next door in in Illinois and we actually I added a single stack revolver production match to get more slots for single stack because we had people that wanted to go to that match. Yeah um you know if you're if you're smart and you want to run a 10 stage carry optics only match on a Saturday and get 200 people through um you can do that. They all have to be members you're gonna get an activity credit you're gonna get one 1.25 on activity credits for dollars turned in um and boost up your activity by doing little special matches like that um there there's way I mean there's ways to boost up activity to get more slots so if you know that Nashville's is going to be in your backyard you know if you are in Indiana Ohio Michigan Kentucky um and you the demand to go to Cardinal with race cut nationals last year you you know you run a an open match a PCC match or you run a you know those those specific division kind of things that boost up your activity um and if anybody knows how to live in the gray area to boost up activity on things call me I I will I there was there was years in Indiana that we ran the SNS 400 the single track production and the section match um all to boost up activity in there and they were 10 stage matches there were club matches that we just added two or three stages to at the base and just you know kind of went hog wild on a Saturday Sunday right so it's kind of like having a cheat code in gives a war or something but it's actually just doing something to gain that that extra slot stuff.

SPEAKER_01 28:10

Yeah they didn't have any demand for them though I mean I know for a while in Louisiana you couldn't give a national slot away because people just weren't interested in going.

SPEAKER_02 28:20

So those always kind of go back but yeah well it also it depends on where it's going to be right so you know if if if it's in Talladega there's probably people in Louisiana that it's close to and it's not you know it's driving distance versus flying distance and um and then again the format right so if it's a three day format and all of a sudden we go to a five day format I it'll be interesting to see how many people now think it's worth two extra hotel nights. So again the formula that we have right now as far as filling it obviously works. The question is how do you make it a little bit more performance based and how do you make registration a little bit smoother um those are the two big things and and I I I hope that becomes some focus and pops up on an agenda in the board to kind of dig into I can tell you that the more emails they get the more it becomes a focus.

SPEAKER_05 29:27

You know I have a solution for not crashing the the practice course server or we go back to paper uh registration sheets.

SPEAKER_01 29:35

Yeah that was always great.

SPEAKER_02 29:38

Yeah we can also go back to mailing out the slots on a big form and then at the time you use them you got to mail them back and with a with a check yeah yeah but you don't you don't have Val to run that anymore so yeah we you don't have me to take that over 21 days of nationals Jake the other night yeah October what do you do in October apparently we're running nationals first through the 31st I guarantee wherever we put it on the ground will be the grainiest month of October.

SPEAKER_00 30:13

Yeah or hotter than the hinges of Hades because that always happened when we were in Vegas I don't know that we ever got rain there but boy did we get a bunch of heat.

SPEAKER_02 30:24

Get heat and got rained on by ricochets.

SPEAKER_00 30:26

Yeah well lead rain.

New RO Service Jersey Colors

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Yeah well guys I appreciate the time to kind of go over this again um after you guys get this out there if anybody has any questions or anything like that um feel free to reach out uh again if you're on the wait list get the email check it out scroll down see where you're at you'll have a pretty good idea as to whether or not you're getting it all right well thanks for stopping by Jake I know this is all we we do get questions now and then we just refer them to you because it's like yeah we don't know but yeah not our job yeah and the last thing I want to do is say oh I think it's like this and then have somebody quote it as gospel and well I I get the emails and I just delete them oh that's forwarded from Kevin delete no I did I did do a response to somebody and Tori was copied on it where the question was like I didn't see anywhere where the dates were for the pre-match so I screenshot the registration circled it in red um highlighted the email that it got when he signed up for the match itself because you get an email that has all that information right um like I said I said this on Brian's podcast yesterday I'm a big teach a man to fish I mean they don't have to ask that question next time yeah but you know it's there's no font until large the people that aren't gonna read it aren't gonna see it. So well the the higher your classification is the lower your comprehensive skill is apparently oh not wrong no custom words were sent by me during the recording of this podcast no anything needed this year.

Recert Survey And Club Culture

SPEAKER_01 32:15

That was freaking awesome all right uh let's see Curry or Judy either of you have any announcements I have a couple go for it so uh first off new colors for years of service jerseys are available out there um these are going to be available through Zero Sports just like the rest of the USPSA jerseys so I think uh 21 to 25 years is raw blue 25 to 30 is black with the uh gold insets and then 30 plus right now is purple so uh if you want to uh the black is still available just as a solid black there's a subdued gray as well and then the the normal kind of light gray RO jersey all of those are available you just have to be certified and you can log on to USPSA's webpage and go to NRI jerseys it'll give you the code and then there's a link that takes you to uh Zero Sports you cannot buy one without being certified and having that code but there's sold at a discount as well so uh I did get a couple comments it's like well you should be giving these away uh yeah yes and no I mean being an RO for 30 years and actually serving as an RO for 30 years are two different things right yeah so for some of the people I know that have served that long sure we'll probably kill my jersey um I gotta work that into the NOI budget or or whatever budget Alan wants to put it under but that's it's not undoable but just to hand them out no that's enough uh you know I mean I might give a purple jersey to a guy who absolutely detests purple might be an Alabama fan and I like purple right I started to make the purple and gold but then I was like that'd be too obvious also the colors of that other school rival in Washington so yeah oh that's right that's right yeah so it may appeal to some people but just the the purple the kind of royal purple you know I thought that would be a good color and um Marie and them at Zero Sports have been great to work with so those are available. Uh second thing we sent a survey out because our uh certification certified number of ROs etc has has fallen off in this this particular month now according to Rick Brotsell our IT guy this is sort of an annual thing that we see and he sent me some numbers and it's not horrible but I I kind of wanted to know you know why people were dropping out. So and this is a two-pronged uh just freaking stop it kind of rant anyway so uh so I got a bunch of them and I've been reading the comments because it asked why you know and most of them are I think probably half of what I got back have said oh I just I just forgot or I didn't get an announcement. And I think that we did have an issue with emails not going to the right places for whatever reason. But some people just said oh I forgot I want to recertify I'll do it as soon as possible and some people have actually turned around and done it right away. Some people another fairly significant number have said that they um uh didn't uh shoot USPSA anymore and wanted to port over to Steel Challenge which we can easily do or they just don't shoot anymore at all and didn't see the point in keeping their certification and that certainly makes sense. So no problem with that either um I've only had two people I think that uh that said they had an issue with with USPSA andor NRI which caused them to not recertify. And one of them was specifically mentioned the cost of level two matches and I hey man I I agree with you I mean if it if it's too expensive but I don't understand how that has anything to do with certifying as a range officer because it's free. We don't we don't recharge for I mean charge you for that for recertification. And the org doesn't set the prices for those matches either right yeah so I I don't know I mean we get all kind of comments but interestingly enough a couple of them have been I don't see the point in holding my certification when my club doesn't ever do anything right right so we we roll back to the club culture thing and you know I I we've got a new thing in our level one presentation that sort of brings up club culture and I really like that because we're getting some suggestions from people in the classes. The last one that I did up in uh Texas last weekend uh they were they were all over it right they were like well we we're having trouble getting our match director to do this and do that right so I said well you gotta politely courteously and professionally try to change that attitude right or start a new club or do whatever I mean there are people out there that want to do it right um but the interesting thing was that you know a few months ago we sent a a newsletter out or an email to all the match directors and club contacts in the country talking about club culture right got back a significant number of responses saying yeah this is great I I appreciate it we're gonna try to do better I can see where we can improve didn't really get a single one back that said you know go kick rocks we're not interested in what you have to say etc um but a couple days ago and I don't get on social media all that much but somebody sent me a link and um and somebody I don't even know who this person was had a copy of the digital version of the of the magazine where that same article was in there right and I went to one of our very well known internet I know everything kind of Mavens you know and and he proceeded to call me a nothing idiot because he didn't want to have anything to do with my culture. It's like guys it's not my culture I I'm not proposing anything I'm saying start doing it right right and if you're opposed to that you're either like Dick said your your reading comprehension is bad if you think that you know that I wanted you to do um but secondly if you're opposed to that then you got no business really playing in the sport you know right so if you know let's just start doing it right because I have had a really a number of people make comments on this survey that you know my club doesn't do things right I can't make them change it etc and that's a hard road to home sometimes. So we want to we want to try to do better with that. We want to try to start pushing that and we started it in our one seminars so that we're training some new people not people that are set in their ways not people that have been doing this forever and you know you can't teach them anything um which is not a good you know kind of position to have uh you should be coachable but just start doing it right and just just freaking stop it quit doing things wrong because you're screwing your members right they the number of people in the seminar I was at that asked questions about what what you mean we can do that you mean this is not a rule yeah yeah and so I was like holy cow um and it was just kind of eye opening for a bunch of them you know so um anyway that's that's the end of that rant but you know let's just try to do better right and calling me names on the internet on the internet yeah so what I don't care my Dillagaf shirt was broken that day but you know yeah all right anything else announcements or otherwise jody anything uh no I don't think so are you still are you are you still suffering from travel I just got back yes Thursday evening at about 7 p.m I have to leave again tomorrow so lucky yeah yeah you got a class yeah yeah but we are own class this weekend but so that won't be yeah it's yeah it's really tough travel you get to go home and see mom and dad yeah very much because it would be possible yeah but the price wouldn't work yeah yeah but no I mean I'm working on stuff but none of it's uh nothing to announce on it yet yeah yeah all right um let's go ahead and dive into the old mailbag here um first one is uh scenarios the stage is being reset and the next shooter who has a PCC approaches with the PCC upright with chamber flag in can he walk through the stage prior to shooting with his gun in that condition in this instance the shooter was DQ'd um and then not told that he was DQ'd until the end of the match.

SPEAKER_00 41:30

Troy I think you answered this person I think it ended up being him is the one.

SPEAKER_01 41:37

Well I mean that just amazes me that you somebody disqualifies you for that. I mean it it's obviously not anything in the rules you're as long as you're muzzle up you got to put a flag in or muzzle down. I mean you know you got to watch your muzzle a little bit more that way but and then to not tell you right away so that you can actually have an effort to kind of fight it uh I mean I know I would I would be like filming the rule that says I can't do that.

unknown 42:03

Right.

SPEAKER_05 42:04

I I wonder if the I wonder if the per the a competition competing another competitor in BCC was the sp was the staff pretty I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 42:14

But yeah so that's totally legal. I mean you can do it prior and walk the stage. I mean it's your turn to walk through right yeah you obviously can't point at the targets but I mean you can walk it and hold it like that and then after you're done shooting you can walk around and look at your targets while they're scored with your with your PCC like that. So there's no difference. I mean I I don't know where the hell that came from but that is a dumb decision.

SPEAKER_05 42:42

Well especially not the tele shooter that's not cool.

Enforcing The Wrist Below Belt Start

SPEAKER_00 42:48

Well but we already and we already know that there are places in the country where a DQ just means you're shooting for no score but you can still keep shooting so you know maybe that's that's not cool that's not cool either. That's totally not cool. And if you ever do that and something bad happens the lawyers will eat you and your club for lunch but it's probably the anti-PCC philosophy which you suppose to yeah yes PCC's not a crime yeah all right um lifestyle choice it's PCC's not a crime it's a lifestyle choice it's a lifestyle choice do you have are you having scared tomatoes like that I could whip that up yeah all right just freaking stop it on one side and PCC is not a crime it's a lifestyle choice on the other all right uh next question uh and this one actually came with pictures but hey this is an audio only podcast so no pictures I'm concerned with risk below the belt start position as an RO I constant constantly see high level shooters um post video Videos where they clearly start wrist below the belt, palm touching the gun, and somehow nobody seems to care. Even at Nationals matches, what am I supposed to do as an RO in this situation? Call on it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the reason they're getting away with it is because nobody's calling them on it.

SPEAKER_05 44:17

Well, everyone's like, oh, but they're a GM. Yeah, you can.

SPEAKER_00 44:22

Right.

unknown 44:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:23

The rules and the rules are the rules.

SPEAKER_05 44:25

And if they get salty about it, you call the rangemas.

unknown 44:29

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 44:30

Yeah, if you looked at the pictures of video from this, that his wrists are nowhere near below his belt. They're not even below the top of the belt, which sometimes people state it that way. And his palm is clearly on the on the grip of the gun, right?

SPEAKER_05 44:43

Yeah. Yeah, that's not cool.

SPEAKER_01 44:45

And how anybody lets him start like that, I don't know. And and how he he obviously doesn't understand that because he's putting his videos out there showing everybody that he's doing doing wrong. So yeah, you you put him in the right start position. And if his arms are that sharp, he's gonna have to do something to get him to get it there, right? I don't know what, but he's gotta do something to get it there. And while you could touch your holster or the or your your forearm can touch the gun, your hand certainly can't. Yeah. So it's just a matter of getting it right. And obviously nobody's paying attention to that, but I'm sure he'll be maybe that that guy will be shooting nascals this year and we can get him squared away.

SPEAKER_05 45:24

Yeah. Well, and also if you're at any match, right, and you see the ROs not enforcing the start position. Speak up. Right. I mean, at Nats, I mean I mean, there's been times that NASA, I'm sitting there, bored range master, and someone comes up and goes, Hey, I don't know if it's an issue, but I saw this happening, da-da-da. And I'm like, you know, okay. So if someone told me there were ROs not enforcing the start position properly, I'd probably go down there and watch for a while and uh educate as needed.

SPEAKER_00 45:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 45:55

You know?

SPEAKER_00 45:55

And if you reshoot reshoots if necessary.

SPEAKER_05 45:59

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 46:00

Because Yeah, that whole squad there, yeah, they y'all need to reshoot the state.

SPEAKER_05 46:04

Just because someone has a high classification level does not mean they know the rules and are doing things legally. No. Nope. I will say the super squad, the true super squad at nationals are the easiest squad to RO. Absolutely. Because they know the rules. And they work hard to reset. And they work hard to reset because they want to shoot. But we have this level of people who are have the high classification level, but are not on the super squad. And, you know, they think they're influencers in the sport, I would say. And sometimes a lot of the times I see those videos and I'm like, yeah, that's not even close to correct. Or they're citing rules and they are not interpreting it correctly. Um, and I'm not saying this is a blanket statement for all of them, but uh there are some. So just be careful with what you see on the internet. Um, we are more than willing to help answer questions. But as an RO, don't ever be afraid of correcting the shooter at the start position. And I, you know, I've corrected some shooters and they're really kind of jerks about it. But we get them in the right position, we start them, you know, and if they're gonna want to continue that conversation after range is clear, I'd be more than happy to call the range master to come talk to them.

SPEAKER_03 47:23

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 47:24

Right. So, you know, and nobody got a GM card by practicing their range officer skills. Nope. No. So that GM card makes you a a decent shooter. It doesn't make you a rules specialist or a good RO, right? No, I'm not saying there aren't some GMs out there that are range officers that are good range officers, because there are. But just because you've got that GM ticket in your pocket don't make doesn't may mean you know what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_03 47:55

Yep. All right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:59

And also don't ask your AI bot of choice NRI, you know, USPSA rules questions. Um, because I've been playing with it every once in a while when some, you know, just typing in questions we get in the mail into you know the bot, whatever bot I happen to be playing with um yeah at that day. And by and large, it's they're at least close. But I've had multiple instances where it's come up with rules from the past or the summary was just out and out wrong. Or just makes up stuff to please you. Yeah. Yeah. It's we know we already know that the bots are uh are trained to tell you what you want to hear. Um yeah. So there have been some pretty high profile incidences of of that with um some criminal activity. And uh so yeah, just just be careful. Um so all right. Moving on.

SPEAKER_05 49:05

Well, you know, the bots, you know, they are they want to please us so they can eventually take over the world and Skynet.

SPEAKER_01 49:14

So that's how Skynet started.

SPEAKER_05 49:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:18

So we've already got the Earth circled by probably AI-based satellite system.

SPEAKER_05 49:23

So I mean Cylons, Skynet, my robot.

SPEAKER_01 49:30

I think there's plenty of movies on the refrigerator is internet connected anymore these days.

SPEAKER_00 49:36

Not mine. Yeah, my toaster most definitely is not internet connected. It barely uses electricity. And it I think actually it may be older than the internet. I'd have to close. Um I've had it since the early 80s.

SPEAKER_05 49:57

So it's actually built out metal and it's gonna last.

SPEAKER_00 50:01

It's actually built out of metal and it actually gets actually gets hot. Um some of the new toasters barely get hot enough to actually toast bread. It takes for freaking ever.

SPEAKER_01 50:12

Yeah. Heaven forbid you might burn yourself with a hot piece of toast.

SPEAKER_00 50:17

Well, that, and you don't have to, you know, the this one has like a whole bunch of heating element wires. And some of these new ones, it's like there's hardly any heating element in them at all.

SPEAKER_01 50:26

Yeah. Well, they wanted it to toast back then. They didn't want you to have to wait all damn morning for a piece of toast that came out barely toasted. I I feel you, man.

SPEAKER_05 50:35

I mean, well, you know, no, you gotta take longer to toast your bread because you gotta you need time for your French press and your coffee to prop properly uh steep.

SPEAKER_01 50:45

Yeah, that's a personal timing problem.

Straddling Two Boxes Stage Design Fail

SPEAKER_00 50:48

I start my coffee first, then I go do the other crap, and by the time you get done with the other crap, it's ready to roll. So insides, I've gone to an aeropress now. It's I love my aeropress. Um, all right. Anyway, moving on. Um was recently in a match, and this and the setup had two square shooting boxes separated by about two feet with a wall in front and targets um beyond the wall. The wall had an opening to engage the targets. You could not engage all the targets from one box. We had one competitor decide to straddle both boxes with one foot in each and engage the targets. The ROs for the squad had a discussion about it, and we could not come up with a rule that you couldn't do this. That's because there isn't one. Um we used 2.2.1.2 as the boxes were part of the shooting area. Are we missing something or is this just bad stage planning? Winner winner chicken dinner.

SPEAKER_01 51:43

Yes, on the bad stage planning. Yeah. Not on the part of the competitor. No. Or whoever stood that up and wrote a stage brief that didn't prohibit that, right?

SPEAKER_00 51:55

Yeah. Yeah, there is no rule that says you can't do that.

SPEAKER_03 51:58

But no.

SPEAKER_00 52:00

Um and yeah, it's do something to prevent that. But I've seen setups like that where they've actually put you know a short wall or something there, so you actually have to back up and go around it to get to the other box. Or a barrel or yeah, right. You know, it's just do something.

SPEAKER_01 52:24

Um you just require them to start in one box and then if they could set, you know, stand across both of them, well, then you if you at least start it in one spot and had to move, you're just not standing there with the ability to shoot everything from that one spot, you know.

SPEAKER_03 52:37

Right. Exactly. Oh well. All right.

SPEAKER_01 52:42

Moving on. Don't be dumb.

RO Class Classification Requirement

SPEAKER_00 52:44

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Moving on. Um, we we had an interesting uh much longer email, but I summarized it down to is classification required to be an RO? Um, I think Troy, you and I both answered this gentleman simultaneously. Thankfully, our our answers actually matched. Um but uh you we do require you to be classified to take the RO class now. If you go back to the ancient history when I took my RO class in 2003, um, I had to be classified and I had to have my application for the RO class signed by my club president or the section coordinator or the area director. Um and, you know, and then I was allowed to attend the class. Somewhere between 2003 and when I became an instructor in 2011, we did away with the classification requirement. And we started seeing a lot of folks showing up in our seminars um who had never actually even seen a USBSA match. They were there to get the RO credential so that they could get keys to the range. Um, they had no interest in the sport at all. They just were interested in getting keys. Well, they didn't understand the sport, they didn't have any basis in the sport. They started asking crazy questions and they slowed the whole class down. Jody was witness to one of these um at a seminar that she put together before she became an instructor. And it was painful. Yeah, we spent, we probably wasted two hours um out of an eight-hour day. Um, well, it was longer than that. Um, you know, answering questions that we shouldn't have had to answer. And so with that, I don't remember when we did it. It was a few years ago. We put back the requirement for certification um or for classification to become certified as an RO to take the RO class. Um there we don't require that, we didn't require that for a very long time. So there are probably a fair number of ROs out there that don't have a classification or their classification is stale. Um and that's fine. There is no requirement for classification to be an RO. And if you are one of those people that's trying to get into an RO class and you're one or two classifiers away from being classified, um and you but it won't let you sign up. Um the class sponsor can contact the instructor and see what the instructor feels, you know. If I recently I let somebody in who needed one more classifier to be classified, and I let them into the class because they were gonna actually shoot that that classifier, you know, the following weekend. So, you know, why not? And they did fine in the class. So we we can make exceptions, but if you have no experience and everything else and you want to just let you in because you're a nice person, eh probably not.

SPEAKER_01 55:57

Right. So we do just to add to that, we do have a couple of things that require some outside information similar to what Kevin was talking about as far as when you're here yesterday, your club president used to have to sign off on you. One of them is is juniors under the age of uh 18 for O classes, right? So you have to be at least 13 to attend. And then you have to have two ROs recommend you to take the class, and there's a form for that. Um in fact, I I had a first this past weekend, I had a a junior shooter that the the two references uh basically said they they didn't think that that junior could do the job. So um I let her audit, right? She sat through it. I watched her. I let her run some competitors in the in the live fire exercise. And she was smart in class and she did a good job with the competitors, but I told her unfortunately because you couldn't take it officially, I can't certify you, right? So I don't want to get in the business of uh me or any other instructor saying, well, you didn't get the endorsements, but you know, you did good, so I'm gonna put you in.

unknown 57:05

Right.

SPEAKER_01 57:06

Right. So there's a reason for that, I'm sure. I I didn't dig into it. I just had to inform them that, you know, hey, you you didn't get the stuff. Uh and then the other thing is like Kempa mentioned for uh for people that haven't had a chance to classify yet, because I ran into this problem at the class I did in Minnesota a couple of weekends ago, you know, and the common statement is we don't shoot much up here in the winter. Well, I can see that. I mean, I can see why. Um, but so then there's some people that have been shooting indoors at different events, not necessarily USPSA events, but they have some experience, they're familiar with it. Um, you know, and and if you have a couple people that recommend them, then you can, you know, the instructor can add those people as well. So there is sometimes a referendum that we put out for, hey, this guy's only shot two classifiers, but everybody's telling me that he should go to the class because he'd make a good RO. So what do you think, right? You get your club president or you get some of the other people in the that shoot with him all the time to say, yeah, he does great, he understands the sport, et cetera. So uh it's not a it's not a card and stone rule, but it's an easy way for us to weed out extremely inexperienced people for range officer seminars because, as you mentioned, it can be very tedious uh for a guy that's just looking for a way into the range so he can practice, right? That doesn't intend to be an RO that ties the whole seminar up because he doesn't understand the terminology, he doesn't understand the sport itself. So not trying to be mean, not trying to make people do anything that costs them a lot of money, but I mean you gotta shoot some, and you have to at least understand what's going on.

Magazine Length Limits Why They Exist

SPEAKER_00 58:47

So yep, absolutely. All right, um uh moving on. Um I like to shoot my H and K 45 US PC in production division. However, 15-round magazine does not comply with the box size, it is too long, so I have to use 12-round magazine, shorting me three rounds on every magazine. Same goes for shooting my HK 45 USP and limited optics and carry optics, which do not have ammunition amount restrictions, um, but limit magazine link to 141.25. If there's no maximum ammunition capacity restriction, then why have a magazine in length restriction? Even Open Division Egg is a magazine linked to restriction of 171.25 millimeters, but no maximum ammunition capacity. Magazine link restrictions seem to encourage and favor shooters that use 9mm and do not allow 45 caliber ores of certain manufacturers to participate unless they are penalized by having to use a lower round count uh magazine to comply with the overall magazine link restrictions. So, why does USPSA have magazine link restrictions in different divisions instead of just using magazine capacity? Well, as I explained to the gentleman that wrote in, um the there's a there's three, there's more than just how many rounds um and magazine length and whatnot in that that whole equation. What part of that equation is major and minor? Um power factor. And in when this when the the the standard of using magazine length came around, we had major, which at the time was predominantly 45 caliber, um, and except in open 38 super. Um, but and then everything else was minor. And so you were making decisions, and we still have this in single stack and revolver today. You're making a decision. Do I want to shoot major and have fewer rounds or lower capacity, or do I want to shoot minor and have more capacity? That's part of the the decision point. I also pointed out that he could, you know, just go shoot his gun and limited um and not have that not have that problem. So um anyway, that's um long and short, but a lot of it's tradition. And that the length magazine length restriction has been that's been in the sport as long as I've been around. And I I don't know how when that came in. Probably when they split limited and open and and uh everything else up. I don't know. It's been a while.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:29

Yeah, it's the same in uh in MC Grows, except theirs is a little shorter. They don't allow the um, you know, we do 141.25 to allow for variations in tube length and and base pad length a little bit. Uh IPSC does not do that, it's 141 dead nuts on 141. So uh, but it's the same thing. And so magazine size does essentially limit capacity to a certain degree, um, but it doesn't specify a number of rounds loaded like some of the other things do. And then in production, I mean, you're shooting uh you're shooting 12-round mags and a 15-round uh stage, and I mean going to 15, I'm not sure that that helped a lot, right? No. As far as planning and making reloads.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:18

Not any rounds per view.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:20

Yeah. So, you know, I mean, if you're gonna move your feet, change the mag kind of thing, same as shooting, same as that. But uh it's it is a traditional thing. Uh why those links came about, I I could not tell you. Um whether it was a joint thing between IPSC and USPSA back in the day when, like you said, they were splitting open and limited uh apart. Um but 141 and a quarter lets you load to whatever max capacity you can and carry optics, which is essentially a sort of production gun-based race type division. Um in you know in IPSC, there's production optics and their round limit is 15 rounds, right? Yep. So, and then if you shoot in some places, all you can shoot is 10. So here in the States or in Canada or some other places, if they have a 10-round magazine capacity limit, you gotta be shooting 10 rounds. If you're not, you're basically breaking the law in that state and you're violating US3SA rules. So depending on where you shoot, that 45 USP uh or US3C may or may not be a disadvantage. Right. You're shooting major, though. I mean, yeah, uh that's the thing is that you know production was designed to be kind of a minor power factor thing based on the old you know nine millimeter crunch and ticker according to Jeff Cooper. But yeah, you want to shoot major, hey, more power to you. I like them big holes, easy to score.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:49

That's great. It's not game. You don't see those much anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:54

Right. Yeah, it's there was a guy in my class this weekend that was that out of everybody when we asked the class what they like to shoot, he piped up with single stack. I was like, all right, you know, manly gun, manly bullets, that kind of thing. And what did he shoot during the live fire? Carry optics, of course.

Aiming While Moving Past Barriers

SPEAKER_00 1:04:13

Yeah, it's I've now had. I had one class so far this year where there was an optic on every single gun. Yeah. During the range exercise. And it's yeah, optics are taking over the world. Um, but you know, I'm not gonna throw rocks. All right, moving on. Um I'm trying to find out the definitive answer for aiming on the move with finger on the trigger across the vision barrier. The target is directly behind or around the vision barrier. The competitor has their gun up and in position and is aiming with their finger on the trigger at the upcoming and coming target. DQ or not. Tred, I'm pretty sure you answered this one.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:56

Yeah, and I based it on the consensus we came to with our RMI kind of discussions. But so as long as you can see the targets and your your gun is up and between your eyes and the target, and you're uh you are essentially aiming at it, uh, then by rule, that's not illegal, right? It's not always a good idea, but it's not illegal. Now, if we had some discussion about changing the way that that rule reads to kind of prevent that, and I think it is a it it is or can be a problem if you're moving and and not shooting, and you lose focus on your target, you shoot the gun and it goes off and leaves the bay, you never get that back, right? So it could be that it's a potential problem. I think it it probably is considered by many to be a potential safety issue. Uh, but right now, under the current rules, you can do it. Um a lot of people do that because they're indexing on it, or maybe they don't do it during the length of the whole vision barrier they're past them because. I mean, we've built some thirty-two foot long walls with no ports in them at some matches where you could traverse that whole wall and look at targets, you know, for for the whole day and not be able to shoot at them yet. Um so that's quite a bit of distance to do it. But I I see a lot of people bringing the gun up as they reach the end of the wall or a port and they're you know aiming, got their finger on the trigger preparing to shoot. Yeah, that's an understandable thing. Uh but if you have it down on your side or or not between your head and the target, and you're just moving along, then that's you're not aiming, so then that's that's a big cute, right? So it's gonna be on the part of the RO, what did he see, what did he call, kind of thing. Right. Um, but again, that's probably gonna be some language discussed about that. Uh as far as I think we had a a good suggestion about just a simple word change that would prevent that. So yeah, just removing a couple words, I think, is what we had. Yeah. So right.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:59

Well, and right now it's okay, not a big and if you're you know if you're putting on a match and you're concerned about that, put so put solid something solid on the wall to be keep people from seeing the target. Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:12

That's why we're having a lot of benthers up to the city.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:15

And you know, and if if people want to aim at a and we, you know, on so even with solid walls, if you know that target's around the corner because you walk the stage and you've got the gun up and you're aiming at the solid wall, is you go around, you know, as long as you're in control of the gun and you're you know, you're not gonna cause a problem, it's not a big deal. I don't see why people feel they need to have their finger on the trigger. Um, because if nobody would be complaining about this at all if people didn't have their fingers on the trigger. And so, you know, anyway.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:49

Yeah, I can I think just people are I think most of our shooters are are good at, you know, it doesn't take they're they're very well disciplined with their trigger finger, right? And then there's some people who want to exploit this rule so they just run around with their finger on the trigger all the time. And that's why the instructors were like, well, you gotta actually be like having the gun up, like you're you're looking through the sites at a target versus just kind of having it around, you know. Yep. Um because otherwise then you're not engaging targets and you're not gonna be engaging the target. Exactly. So this is this is one of those things I remember we we talked about at the last in-person instructors conference we had, and it like wasted at least a couple hours and we didn't come up with a solution.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:38

Right.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:39

And I think I think now we have a more reasonable solution that we could implement if the board approves it. Um but it's not the first time this has come up. And it's become when we all all the clubs were using solid walls, it wasn't an issue. It's only since we started using the mesh walls that it's really become an issue. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:05

I think the mesh walls provide more benefits than they do deterrence, you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:14

Yeah. Yep. All right.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:20

Um, next question. If a competitor shoots under a wall at a target, do they also get the FTSA penalty? Troy, I think this was you.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:30

Yes. No, yes, it is me. And yes, you get the FTSA penalty. You have to look up the you have to look up the definition of engaging in the glossary, but it's uh shooting at a target that's legally available and under a wall because walls go to the ground. It's not legally available. But if you shoot at a target under a wall, you're gonna get an FTSA and you're gonna get the mics on it because obviously that is deemed to be impenetrable, right? So that's that's gonna be no bueno on your part. It's not a DQ, but it ain't a score either. It's pretty heavy penalty right there.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:05

So well, it could be a DQ if they break the 180 or do something else.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:13

But that's the problem with you know sometimes you have people that are new and they don't understand and or they're a little bit confused about what they're looking at on the stage, and they can look through a certain area and see a popper, right? So I can see that popper right here. Well, you're looking at it under the wall, you know. So uh could be an issue, but that's the rule, and that and that's why the the person that asked asked to support it with a rule, and of course it's in the glossary, which is in the appendix, which is a rule section of the book.

Steel Challenge Stop Plate Identification

SPEAKER_00 1:10:45

So yep. Okay. Um can I please ask for some clarification regarding stop plates? This is a steel challenge question, obviously. We paint our plates white as that is the easiest color. Some members have asked if we can paint the stop plate a different color for easy identification. I can't see anything in rule 4.1 that would prevent this. Would this be allowed, please? Not the plate. Paint the stick. Yeah, a lot of people paint the post.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:17

Right. I answered this question and I don't remember exactly what I answered about.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:26

That was pretty much it. I did a lot of them. Yeah, you can paint the post. Paint the post red or whatever, not the plate.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:36

Yeah, I think it says they all gotta be painted the right color. All right.

Rule 1.1.5.5 Now Any Match Level

SPEAKER_00 1:11:44

And then another easy one, this is also for the steel challenge hooks. A quick question in a level one steel challenge match, is it a requirement to have one certified RO for each stage or squad? No. No, it is not. It's and it's it's recommended, of course, but um if you don't have them, then you know you can you can uh still have your match. Moving on. Um I'm shooting a re local section championship, which is a level two match, and one of their stages, they've written stage briefing requires you to stay within the shooting area. Question of the month says that it's only allowed for level one matches. However, if you look at the wording of rule 1.1.5.5, it doesn't say anything about it being for level one matches only. What's up?

SPEAKER_05 1:12:36

Yeah, I don't I don't know if because the current question of the month also deals with this rule. So I don't know if the person was referring to a previous question of the month because we might have had a previous question of the month, but quite possibly the current question of the month for the month of April 2026 does not specify a match level, but it does have a WDC WSB that invokes 1155. Um and it looks like uh there's quite a few people being I was just looking at the results that maybe aren't up on the rules change that happened in March.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:09

Even though we talked about it.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:10

Yeah, 1155 used to only be of level one matches, but this year it got that restriction got removed, so uh you can have it anywhere. At all match levels. Um so that you know, that might influence how you answer the question of the month, but we're not gonna talk about that question. But uh it is a per shot penalty after you've shortcut outside the shooting area.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:42

Right.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:44

Actually some of the com some of the comments uh on I put the question of the month on Facebook, and some of the comments there were quite interesting too.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:53

I'm sure. Okay, I think that's the end of the mailbag. Um, you got anything else? Sounds like no. I can't believe it's almost made.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:11

Yeah, despite it being 36 degrees and colder than the engines.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:15

Uh come on, Cavalier, that's just normal for the police.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:17

I know, but I can still bitch about it. Okay, fine. Especially when it's 78 degrees on Saturday, which was glorious.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:23

Yeah, that's again, that's just springtime on the police.

unknown 1:14:26

Yeah.

Seminar Scheduling Tips And Wrap Up

SPEAKER_00 1:14:27

Um, yeah, it's it's not unusual here to have snow in the morning and 80 degrees in the afternoon. So oh well. All right. Well, hearing nothing else, um, thanks everybody for uh listening to the podcast again. As always, if you have questions or comments, uh rules at uspsa.org and we'll get an answer back to you as soon as we can. Um we've got some busy weekends coming. Um, I think not this weekend, but next weekend, we have six or seven seminars all happening at the same on the same weekend um throughout the nation. This weekend, this coming weekend, I think we have five. Um, so we're we've got instructors going everyone's direction, getting some seminars taken care of. Um, if your club is looking to have a seminar, go ahead and get that request in um and we'll get an instructor assigned to you and get you headed in the right direction. I've already got one class uh in October for myself, and I there are many others coming in uh for the fall. So get those requests in early and uh we'll get you taken care of. And we do do seminars during the summer, during the shooting season. Um, we don't tend to do as many of them. People are busy doing vacations or shooting matches or whatever, um, but for whatever reason, we don't tend to do as many seminars during the summer, but we are available to do uh seminars in the summer. Uh it may be a little bit more difficult to get an instructor. Don't pick a seminar around the holiday weekend because travel gets extremely expensive. Um and instructors like to uh spend holidays with their families too. So uh, but you know, that there's only a couple holidays in the summer that are gonna impact in there. Yeah, what Mother's Day Well, Mother's Day, Father's Day, there's Mother's Day, Father's Day.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:35

We had requested on Mother's Day.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:38

Yeah. I mean, I the the worst class I ever had. The worst attended class I ever had was on Easter at two students. Um and uh Mother's Day usually doesn't work out. Oddly enough, Father's Day doesn't usually work out 4th of July, just forget it. Um and uh Juneteenth, if you're if if if that falls near uh a weekend, um that could be a thing. Um and then you get all you know Memorial Day and you get to Labor Day, and uh then we seem to get a lot more classes so after Labor Day.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:18

We like holidays too.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:20

So there's 72 on the books right now, either completed or still scheduled. So uh we're still getting trickling, and so I don't know if we'll make last year. At first I thought we were gonna break last year's record, and we still might if people start picking them up somewhere in fall, you know. But National's week is certainly a bad week to request a seminar. Okay. So we want to kind of avoid that as well. And then there's several area matches coming up, right? But if in fact, in front of the area six match, Billy Harrington, the Area Six director, has scheduled a CRO seminar at Talladega in their classroom. Uh since Dan Bernard is going to range master that match, he's volunteered to teach it, and they're gonna do it on a Wednesday, Thursday prior to the match. So that's not an undoable thing, right? If you have the place and the time to do it. In fact, I've been thinking about how we might be able to try to do that at Nashals. Uh, I haven't come up with a good plan for that yet because we the whole week's just about occupied. So um I I don't know when we can actually make that happen. We have done it in the past, but now we we use the whole week up at Nashals. We start with ROs and RMs on Tuesday and walk stages and then Wednesday, Thursday is pre-match, Friday, Saturday, Sunday is main match.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:41

That means you'd have to be there the weekend before for most people to make it, which again is gonna be a problem. You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:48

Well, we used to do it on changeover day and between the back to backs and you know, because yeah, we don't have that anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:54

We don't have that. Right. So that was sometimes that was a blessing, and sometimes it was it was a curse, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:19:02

Yeah, yeah, it was. Well, and you know, the the problem is the instructors that were teaching it have just been all up for one match on their feet the whole three or four days. Now they're on their feet all day to teach, and then they're on their feet for the uh for the next match. And that was and I think every I've taught in every single one of those I was ever at. So um, you know, we got a lot of good CROs out of it, but uh I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:31

I did one at a at a range in the Midwest uh during either prior to the match or during setup or during the turnover. I think it was prior to the match. And of course, we took the class out to look at all the stages that had been set up and the max director said if if they do anything to any of my stages, I'm gonna kill them, right? I mean, because you've been spending a lot of time doing that, and and um so don't you know that I'm watching these guys walk a stage and I see two of them pull a target up and move it? Oh my god. And I was yeah, that's what I said. I was like, what in the H E double toothpicks do you think you're doing? Well, this was in the wrong place. So I was like, dude, you better put that back before you incur the wrath of Thor on this thing here. So they put it back, right? And then just as a joke, I had several blank pieces of paper, and I I after we were done, I walked up to the master rector and I said, These are all the notes they took on how bad your stages are. I thought he was gonna lose it. I'm just kidding, I'm just kidding, you know. He had a murderous look in his eyes. But uh yeah, so there's ways that you can do it. I think I think Billy's approach is okay because they're not using that whole week entirely, right? So um, but if if you know if it's if we look like we can possibly do that at some point, then that may come back. But the back-to-back was the best way to do it. But then again, it had its own problems for both the instructors and the student.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:03

So yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:05

So not a bad learning experience, but bad to uh bad to facilitate.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:10

Yeah. Yeah, it's yeah, and it's you know, and it again, you know, we we can teach classes in conjunction with matches like that, um, sectionals, um, you know, areas, whatever. Just you know, if you think it might work out, you know, piss the idea at us. Um, and if you think you can put the bodies in the seats, then that's really all that matters.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:36

Yeah. I mean, you want to have one the weekend before your match starts, and you're not gonna be having all those people out there on the race doing something, then that's not a bad idea. But just gotta be able to work around the dates and make sure people can attend.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:53

Yep. So all right.

How To Find Or Request Seminars

SPEAKER_00 1:21:58

Anything else? Again, folks, if you've got questions or comments, rules at uspsa.org, and we look forward to hearing from you. Um, been getting a lot of positive response to the podcast and appreciate that. So um we look forward to hearing from you. With that, thanks, and we'll see you again in two weeks. Bye, everybody. Bye. Goodbye. Are you looking to take your first range officer class? Maybe you're looking to upgrade to chief range officer or audit a seminar to brush up on your rules knowledge. The complete list of upcoming classes can be found by following the link to find NROI seminars under the NROI tab at USPSA.org. No class is near you. Your club can sponsor an NROI seminar. Follow the request seminar link under the NRY tab at USPSA.org.